[.11] Definition of Blunt vs Edged

Feldor

Scholar
With the removal of race based weapon type restrictions, and with the rising popularity of latex weapons, many of which are not thrusting legal, I'd like to suggest a clarification of the current weapon definitions. Specifically, I'd like to suggest that the term blunt vs edged refer solely to if the weapon physrep has been judged by a Marshal to be safe for thrusting. This could be referred to IG as if the weapon has a blunt tip or edged tip. This will provide a simple in-game way to ask if a borrowed weapon is safe and legal for thrusting. This in no way affects item tags, as they use descriptive words like "long hammer, short mace, long sword, short axe, polearm" - none of which specify if the prop needs to be edged or blunt. Note that this could result in 'blunt' swords and 'sharp' maces. (Google image search for katzbalger for a blunt sword, or morning star for a sharp mace if you need OOG justification for why this might be reasonable).

If enacted, this would suggest a minor clarification in the "Weapon construction" and "Weapon Guidelines" sections, probably changing out the term "blunt weapons" for "headed weapons". Additionally each of "One Handed Blunt" and "Two Handed Blunt" should include the prohibition about blunt weapons being used for thrusting.

For reference, here are all the non-race based references to blunt weapons and weapon types from the 1.3 rulebook:
One Handed Blunt
This skill allows the character to wield a one handed blunt weapon. This includes any blunt Small, Short, or Long close combat weapon. A blunt weapon cannot be used for thrusting, and any thrust with the tip of the weapon does no damage.

One Handed Edged
This skill allows the character to wield a one handed edged weapon. This includes any edged Small, Short, or Long close combat weapon. It also allows the use of a one-handed spear which may only be used as a thrusting weapon.

Polearm
This skill allows the character to wield any hafted two handed weapon with a blade on the far end (a meat cleaver on a stick). This includes weapons like two handed axes and halberds.

Two Handed Blunt
This skill allows a character to wield a two handed blunt weapon.

Two Handed Sword
This skill allows a character to wield a two handed sword, and only a two handed sword. Any other two handed edged weapon falls under the Polearm skill.


From "Weapon Construction":
All striking surfaces of the weapon must be protected with at least 5/8" thick closed cell foam. If 5/8" foam is not available two layers of thinner foam may be used if the combined thickness is greater than 5/8". In addition, all non-striking surfaces which may come into contact with another player (such as the shaft of a blunt weapon or polearm, crossguards, and the flats of sword blades) must be protected with sufficient closed cell foam to ensure safety should accidental strikes happen with those areas of the weapon. Weapons which do not have sufficient padding on non-striking surfaces will absolutely be disallowed from play. If you are unsure what qualifies, it’s always best to stick with a minimum of 5/8" thick foam on all sections of the weapon above the grip.

From "Weapon Guidelines":
Blunt weapons, axes, one handed spears and pole arms must have a padded head that is shaped appropriate to the weapon type. This padded head must be made out of foam and it must be placed over the 5/8" pipe insulation that covers the core. The head must be noticeably thicker than the pipe insulation and should squash easily. Everything above the grip area must be padded—like all weapons, any part that might come into contact with your opponents should have foam padding. Note that blunt weapons may never be used to thrust.
 

Muir

Fighter
I like this, but only if tags are adjusted to just be 'long weapon' 'short weapon' small weapon' rather than edged and blunt, because a marshal's call on thrusting safety is subjective on the day.

Honestly, that's probably a good idea anyway, having two types of otherwise identical statline weapons doesn't have any game design positives now that races aren't restricted from using them.
 

Feldor

Scholar
For what its worth, my tags at the moment don't specify edge vs blunt. They say things like "Long Hammer" and "Short Mace". The blacksmithing skill for tag generation is for specific weapon shapes and sizes, not for edged vs blunt.
 

Muir

Fighter
Yeah, the 'Hammer' and 'Mace' imply 'Blunt', much as 'Sword' and 'Axe' necessarily imply 'Edged'. The only real change would be the rules.
 

mythic

Knight
Owner
Calgary Staff
Our tags have the weapon name and the skill required to use them, plus base damage and "market value". This makes it super easy for any player to grab a weapon, read the tag and know if they have the proper skill to use it.
 

Feldor

Scholar
Interesting. I have weapon tags from 3 chapters, and none of them have the skill, base damage, or market value on them. Admittedly, some of those tags are quite old so if this was a recent innovation I may just have old tags.
 

mythic

Knight
Owner
Calgary Staff
Interesting. I have weapon tags from 3 chapters, and none of them have the skill, base damage, or market value on them. Admittedly, some of those tags are quite old so if this was a recent innovation I may just have old tags.
What can I say? We are innovative! ;)
 

Attachments

Gilwing

Baron
Alliance Logistics
All that information on those tags are oog as weapon tag, along with the physrep are the IG representation of the weapon. Also how does logistics determine the "market value" of it? Now if it had the pp value I would understand as some one can just use the rulebook to find that out on their own nut logistics saying how much it's worth is just wrong, plus you kind of force your smiths to charge that listed price.
 

mythic

Knight
Owner
Calgary Staff
All that information on those tags are oog as weapon tag, along with the physrep are the IG representation of the weapon. Also how does logistics determine the "market value" of it? Now if it had the pp value I would understand as some one can just use the rulebook to find that out on their own nut logistics saying how much it's worth is just wrong, plus you kind of force your smiths to charge that listed price.
It's just double production. What a BS wants to charge for it is not our concern. But to a new player, that is important information. (esp because they can merchant it for 1/2 cost which is EXACTLY what the rulebook states). PP is an OOG detail. CP or SP value is actually what the currency is.
 

Gilwing

Baron
Alliance Logistics
The rulebook as it stands allows some one to merchant for full pp value. Your telling them half of the double you put on that tag.
Alliance Rulebook said:
This skill also allows the character to sell game items (potions, scrolls, alchemical substances, armor, weapons, and traps) to Logistics during normal Logistics periods for their Production Point value in game money. Items that are not produced through the Production Point system (components, ritual scrolls, magic items, etc.) cannot be traded in, and must be sold in-game. Merchanting only recovers the production point value of an item, not its entire crafting cost
 

mythic

Knight
Owner
Calgary Staff
The rulebook as it stands allows some one to merchant for full pp value. Your telling them half of the double you put on that tag.
Uhm, yeah. Because that ends up being the PP value. A dagger is 5pp (which is 5cp) so, double is 10cp (1sp). So, if they merchant it, they get 5cp. Not sure why this is an issue for you. But I’m pretty much done with this odd conversation.
 
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