[.11] Is Natural Armor a 'suit' of armor?

jwconvery

jwconvery

Spellsword
Just curious if Shatter would work on Natural armor.

-Joe
 
We discussed this at a Playtest Packet meeting. Yes, you can Shatter Natural Armor, and it works the same was as Shattering Indestructible or Arcane Armor, including being able to be refit with 60 seconds of Focus.
 
Sage of Legaia said:
We discussed this at a Playtest Packet meeting. Yes, you can Shatter Natural Armor, and it works the same was as Shattering Indestructible or Arcane Armor, including being able to be refit with 60 seconds of Focus.
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I would submit a suggestion that since this kind of armor is more prevalent that a lack of real intelligence would keep a monster from refitting. Like to me a lesser undead would not refit their natural armor if left idle and damaged for whatever reason. Greater undead? Sure. Seems a worthy thing to consider on a card for a newly common defence of monsters.

Just a passing thought.
 
I will half agree? Obviously a Skeleton isn't going to break off of combat to go "fix its ribcage" (or whatever), but I would say that if you leave it alone and it does nothing else for a few minutes it would start to regenerate its Natural Armor; it's mindless, but also a supernatural thing that could theoretically regenerate some kind of rigid outer bone layer while idle.
 
Or be instructed to do so by a controlling individual
 
Sage of Legaia said:
I will half agree? Obviously a Skeleton isn't going to break off of combat to go "fix its ribcage" (or whatever), but I would say that if you leave it alone and it does nothing else for a few minutes it would start to regenerate its Natural Armor; it's mindless, but also a supernatural thing that could theoretically regenerate some kind of rigid outer bone layer while idle.
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I would kinda agree with that too. Natural armor is supposed to represent a defence that lets healing bypass it. That way we don't have to go all doubling damage again (nightmare). I support this theory. For lessers it seems that if they could "heal" themselves it is an over all change to the creature and grants a totally new ability. If it is just a part of what they are then I say let it be. Now for greaters... this kinda starts to make sense. But the armor is still damaged, just like their body.

To me if they can repair the armor then previously they should have had healing abilities. This more thematic that I am thinking of, not as much balance but it still speaks to it some.
 
FWIW, I’d interpret an Undead refitting their natural armor IG as drawing in the powers of necromancy to regenerate their damaged forms, an instinctive thing.
 
Yeah, that's basically my interpretation of it, too, Draven. It might take them a bit of idling around before it happens, but it's mostly a passive thing that requires them to be mostly inactive.

It also explains why Undead don't show up with damaged armor/body already: they haven't been damaged or had to attack anything in a while, so the necromantic magic holding them together healed them over time.
 
If refitting armor (no matter the source) requires concentration, I would say that they can't unless controlled by some one.
 
I think we are getting a bit into the weeds, and into individual plot team world building territory. Both seem like perfectly reasonable ways for undead to behave depending on plot interpretations.
 
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Well... technically all it requires is Focus, which in game terms means not using any game abilities and not running. You can still read a book or practice swinging weapons while Focusing, so there's no reason an idling Undead couldn't enter some kind of Focus state and repair their Natural Armor, even if it amounts to "stand still with a slack jaw for 60 seconds".
 
How did you get to the point you can shatter natural armor? The playtest rules don't say anything about it that I can find. Per ARB

Natural Armor: Some monsters have skin
that acts like armor. It can be refit in sixty seconds.
It cannot be Shattered or Destroyed nor
can it be salvaged after the creature is killed.
Creatures with natural armor can never
wear physical armor nor Arcane Armor at the
same time. Natural Armor is not subject to the
restrictions for physical armor

Per the playtest packet on Shatter

Shatter: Note that a target must be called even if this effect is delivered via the Weapon qualifier. The Fighter skill that can deliver a Shatter is now delivered with the Strike keyword. Shatter will now work on any suit of armor, even if it is over 20 points. Shatter now affects any single item up to a Door-sized item (instead of Shield-sized). If it is an invalid target for a Shatter (such as an object greater than door-sized) the object will remain unaffected. If Shatter is used on an indestructible suit of armor, the armor will still be reduced to 0 points (and thus require a refit before its Armor Points are restored) but the tag will not be destroyed. This damage also occurs on magical armor sources such as Arcane Armor.
 
That may be something we missed in the packet. The intention of "now work on any suit of armor" definitely includes Natural Armor, but I agree that it could be made much more explicitly clear.

-Bryan
 
Great, thanks for the clarification Polare. That's how we played it this weekend and then I went to look up the actual rule.
 
Looking at the text, it'd probably be clearer if we changed that last line:

"This damage also occurs on magical armor sources such as Arcane Armor."

to be more explicit:

"This damage also occurs on all other sources of Armor Points, including both magical armor sources (such as Arcane Armor and Celestial Armor) and Natural Armor."
 
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