Poll: Lets talk about DoomBlow

Are you a rogue and do you think doomblow is a good capstone skill for rogues?

  • I am a Rogue, I think Doom blow is underwhelming.

    Votes: 11 25.6%
  • I am a Rogue, I think Doom blow is good.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I am not a Rogue, I think Doom blow is underwhelming.

    Votes: 13 30.2%
  • I am not a Rogue, I think Doom blow is good.

    Votes: 5 11.6%
  • I am a Scout/Adept, I think Doom blow is underwhelming.

    Votes: 14 32.6%
  • I am a Scout/Adept, I think Doom blow is Good.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    43

Tantarus

Squire
Doom Blow - 5 XP (Rogue), 60 XP Stealth Skills per purchase, Daily - the character may, once per Logistics period per purchase, make a single attack From Behind and gain the Doom carrier. This may be combined with an Assassinate or Slay for additional damage.
I have played a rogue far in the past and changed back to the class for 2.0. Overall I really enjoy it, but one thing I have come to believe is that doom blow is pretty underwhelming, to the point I am considering selling my 5 back and picking up 12 waylays instead. That it just adds a carrier and isnt nearly the power level of eviscerate is disappointing to me. Eviscerate is the whole package, it adds a very powerful carrier and a large amount of damage, while able to be used without a positional requirement. Doom blow on the other hand many times needs to be paired with another skill to be effective. And has far more defenses that work on it, Racial resist curse, cloak/bane curse, in addition to the normal parry/evade/dodge stuff. I will admit it is more powerful then eviscerate in one way, you cant resolute it.

I thought I was alone in this thinking until a recent thread about 2.0 stuff that had about 2 pages of rogues talking about there disappointment in the skill. Personally I think it should be a whole skill that comes with a larger numerical attack by default. Or honestly I would be happy if it was just changed to 500 body, a boring fix, but a pretty much straight upgrade for most rogues.

Please share your thoughts on this. I am curious to hear from rogues and non rogues alike. But I would really like to hear from current 2.0 rogues about there experience with the skill over all and thoughts on it.

EDIT: Added options for scout/adept. (Errr... I cant edit actual pole options, I messed up that last one, should be "I am a scout/adept, I think doom blow is good." Any chance a Mod can fix it? @Paladin of Earth @Paladin of Air ?)
 
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Mark of Chaos

Artisan
Denver Staff
Former rogue, changed out to spellsword with 2.0. Seems underwhelming and easily defendable, on top of requiring other skills to use. Havent put any thought into fixes though as I have no plan to return to the backstab life any time soon.
 

Renner

Scout
Am a scout and didn't bother to take doom blow, underwhelming, over taxing on multiple skills to use. Don't ever plan to buy it.
 

PirateFox

Scholar
I did buy it, but it's very much underwhelming...though I can attribute that largely to statting. Locally, due to lack of resources, it's pretty common to stat creatures with either curse immunity or many defenses. The only time I think I've seen doomblow land is on minor creatures I want gone asap, or when surprising something larger after it's already been pounded by many other people.
 

Feldor

Scholar
Marshal
On my character who does most of their damage from behind and could buy one, I don't plan on buying it. I'd want my damage go through rather than have it cloak'd or resisted. The only real use I see for it is as part of riposting blow.
 

Tantarus

Squire
In retrospect I should have made the pool "I have doomblow, and X" not rogue. I am going to add another slot for scout/adept, change your votes as applies

Also, how would you fix doom Blow if you where in charge of changing it?
 

MondayMcGee

Scholar
San Francisco Staff
Adept here, do not have doom blow and am not planning to buy it currently. It would be more attractive to me as Weapon Doom, or if it was fairly significantly less expensive.
 

Tantarus

Squire
Adept here, do not have doom blow and am not planning to buy it currently. It would be more attractive to me as Weapon Doom, or if it was fairly significantly less expensive.
This is kinda my thought. Weapon doom, making it, its own skill. That said not sure I would want it still, Because of cost, you can get 2.5 waylays which are same defense and nearly as effective.

I would not mind if it was changed to "Your assassinate damage with a doom carrier" As to not have to pair it up with other skills to be effective. Or honestly, drop the price to 2/3 build and just make it "Your assassinate with body carrier". It is more likely to land that way.
 

Draven

Count
Seattle Staff
Marshal
This is kinda my thought. Weapon doom, making it, its own skill. That said not sure I would want it still, Because of cost, you can get 2.5 waylays which are same defense and nearly as effective.

I would not mind if it was changed to "Your assassinate damage with a doom carrier" As to not have to pair it up with other skills to be effective. Or honestly, drop the price to 2/3 build and just make it "Your assassinate with body carrier". It is more likely to land that way.
IMO, Waylay is pretty underpriced considering the Paralysis boost for Earth casters that also helped you guys. :p

But yeah, Doom needs to either drop in price, be a Weapon Doom, or be a self-sufficient source of damage.
 

Tantarus

Squire
IMO, Waylay is pretty underpriced considering the Paralysis boost for Earth casters that also helped you guys. :p

But yeah, Doom needs to either drop in price, be a Weapon Doom, or be a self-sufficient source of damage.
Or a combo of these.
 

airkshil

Scholar
Scout here. I took doom blow but it is considerably underwhelming to me. Weapon doom would be worth the build I spent on it
 

Azmodeous

Artisan
Owner
Seattle Staff
Scout here. I play tested Doom blow and saw absolutely no use for it. 0/10 would not buy.
 

Mori

Newbie
Alliance Logistics
Rogue-into-someday-Scout. I have one Doom Blow to stack on my three Retributions and that's in a game that had things that took extra hurt from curses.

It doesn't do much of anything for flavor. It makes things use a Parry/Dodge/Evade/Cloak/Resist Curse instead of Parry/Dodge/Evade/Resilience which is, like, whatever. You *have* to use another skill or it is stopped by armor. It could apply to four hits in a row or something, so it rewarded the rogue drum roll, or just be replaced by something useful.

(Nothing in modern rogue makes up for the loss of actual waylay, IMO)
 

Darkcrescent

Knight
Chicago Staff
Marshal
I feel having just one purchase is enough for Riposting Blow. Other than that underwhelming skill.
 
Scout-tastic. Doom is not very useful, probably going to trade it in. A tri-burst function (get to swing Doom carrier three strikes in a row within a three count, up to three targets) would make it fun and useful.
 
Specifically as a high level earth adept, Doom Blow feels 100% superfluous, because I can spellstrike Doom and that is almost always strictly better.

Frankly, the ability to kill small to mid-range targets doesn't seem to need any help using a Stealth-focused skill set, and against big targets Doom Blow carries the twin issues of being an obvious place to use defensive skills and also failing against armor. Doom Blow does not effectively address an area of need for Stealth characters in the way that Eviscerating Blow does for Martial ones.

Honestly, the more I've been thinking about it, the more I feel like the most fun aspect of playing with the Stealth skills is having a versatile toolkit that rewards playing patiently and taking smart risks, and enables that play with powerful defensive options if your risk turns out to have been not so smart after all. I don't want to overpower my target, I want to outwit them and have the exact right trick up my sleeve at the exact right time. I think a worthy Stealth capstone is a skill that allows the user to replicate any other single use Stealth skill.
 

Draven

Count
Seattle Staff
Marshal
Specifically as a high level earth adept, Doom Blow feels 100% superfluous, because I can spellstrike Doom and that is almost always strictly better.
I think that's going to be based on your chapter. I see so much Resist Magic up here that the idea of a Weapon Doom for me is actually really hot. There's also a reason that I'm going to have United Blow within the next few months.
 
I get that, but I do have a counterpoint to offer: monsters do not have infinite resistances. Using up a Resist is a valuable thing to do, but it is wasteful to target more than one kind of delivery and Effect Group when wearing a target down in that way. The results of a burned Resist Magic are, in my estimation, more beneficial than the results of 15 or 20 lost armor points, which so far in 2.0 seems to be what Doom Blow is struggling most with, at least in my experience. Now Weapon Doom might be better than either 15 Doom or Spellstrike Doom, but between just those two currently available options, the spellstrike has been strictly better to my mind, not least because I can look someone in the eye as I do it.
 

Gilwing

Baron
Alliance Logistics
The better question is, why do most people think that we should be taking things out in one shot? Would players rather use 4 effects on 4 different "monsters" to take them out or 3 resists and then the take out on the 4th? If everyone wants to use their one ability to take out that one "monster" then I just send out 4 more lives than I normally would. Same result, oh and treasure every 4th life too
 
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