Gentle Reminder: Level Disparity and Treasure

mikestrauss

Virtuous
Folks,
This season HQ has a larger number of new players and low level characters than it has had in recent seasons. This is awesome and great for the game, but also causes some difficulties. One of those difficulties arose during the last event. At least a couple times during the event a low level character was engaging an NPC and dealt moderate or considerable damage to the NPC only to watch a high level PC come in an deliver a final blow and then take all the treasure. I personally believe that these incidents are not caused by malice on the part of the high level PC player, but simply because the player didn't even realize what had transpired.

This shouldn't be considered an accusation or an attack on anyone's character. This post is simply a gentle reminder for our higher level players to try to be cognizant of the situation (especially in wave battles) and try to let the lower level characters earn there rewards, too. Hopefully all players are trying to make the game a better experience for each other at all times, in which case this gentle reminder is basically unnecessary.

Michael Strauss
 
Meh. I don't have to remind anyone how long I have been playing. I play a weaponless scholar. My wife plays an archer templar. The fact is we don't get treasure from combat. By the time we reach a body to loot it, it's been looted. Yes, I can make a big fuss about it In-Game but it doesn't change anything and would just make me look like I was only playing for the loot.

What I mean to say is this isn't necessarily a high level vs low level thing. It happens to plenty of folks. I have accepted it as part of the game. It would be nice if things were different, but I don't see it happening.
 
I'm just putting it out there.

I was the elf fighter in a green and black tunic with an oddly shapped green and black shield.

If I ninjad your kill. Let me know with a PM. I'm serious.

Stephen
 
I think Mike's point was directed at newer players. Majority of new people who play this game might not understand how the game runs, looting, searching, killing stuff. Also being new sometimes you do not want to create that kind of conversation/confrontation. I think he is asking people to be considerate of that.

If you are an experienced player and are not getting loot from kills, then that is a total IC scenario. There are plenty of ways in game, for a pc to ask another pc to share or "hey i hit that with a couple of flame bolts". On the other hand if your pc is convinced asking for a share will only make you look bad, then that's an Ic issue and should remain IC. Your character felt that way you should be fine. Plus if your a high level weaponless scholar you can always just over charge for items you sell from the mages guild!!! (OMG im j/kidding...)

For real though,

OOC and IC, its not so much what you say but how you say it. And since we are on the topic of proper etiquette on new players. We should all be a little more sensative and aware of our BRAND new players. Not pointing fingers, not trying to make anyone look bad, just bringing it up.

EXAMPLE: a few times this weekend, NEW player A would come out. During a battle or mod, he would throw a packet and the wording was a bit off or his slay wording was a bit off. Instead of 4 people yelling at him "BLOWN!" Take a second to explain why it was blown. I know i took the spells of a few miscants and simply told the NPC the correct way for the future, but i burned the spell shield anyway. Also when we do take the time to tell him/her why it was a miscast or how to correct the ruling/wording, we should stop hitting for repeated damage. I know some are new, but the proper response to this isn't, "Well new players should learn the rules" and thats that. While they should learn the rule, we all should do our part to educate and walk them through their errors. After all they are our NPC's, without them what do we have? 6 man wave battles with sheets stated to kingdom com... Then we are back to the original problem.. 50 pc's trying to loot 6 monsters, and Nathan Westwind not getting a thing!

-Toddy
 
Ithica said:
I think Mike's point was directed at newer players.

I don't.

One of those difficulties arose during the last event. At least a couple times during the event a low level character was engaging an NPC and dealt moderate or considerable damage to the NPC only to watch a high level PC come in an deliver a final blow and then take all the treasure.

My point was that this is an issue with deep roots both in and out of game. and as far as your nathan comments, i know you were joking and all but (and take these comments as light-hearted as well) I'm not the one that felt the need to start the thread. i commented because i don't think you can dictate this kind of stuff and expecting people not to loot (old or new) is the real joke.
 
I meant his point was directed FOR newer players, not AT.

And my comments were nothing more then jokes or playful teasing. I am just oblivous if there is an actual real issue with loot not being dispersed. So i guess what i said is from a different stand point.

I guess i have never had a problem IC with asking for a share or sharing treasure. I try to do my part by handing coin out to newer players and lower level players to make sure each person gets a piece or at least something after a wave battle. Not only to give freely unto others, but also as a player to make sure everyone feels they get compensated in some way for their part.
 
Toddy, stop stealing my kills!

Pay your healers! At least pay Drak, or he will killing blow you next time instead of cure lighting you!

Scott
 
The point I was trying to make is that all players should be sensitive to the play experience of other players, ESPECIALLY new players. A bad play experience in a first or second game can drive away a new player forever.

Furthermore, I was trying to point out that a major way that PCs can be sensitive to the play experience of new players is by trying to avoid doing drive by kill-loots on NPCs being engaged by new players. It isn't the only way PCs can help improve play experience, but it is a rather meaningful way.

-MS
 
I think overall our players are pretty welcoming and sensitive to new players: I've seen multiple players help give instructions, encouraging words, bring low level players on modules and trips into the woods, and even back off while low level players engage an enemy and let them get the kill.

That being said, kill stealing is an in-game issue and should be handled as such. This isn't WoW where you can set loot rules, nor do I ever want it to be.

If you think this was such a rampant issue last event as to cross the line into player-bashing, I encourage you to bring it to me as GM or Eric as customer service. Otherwise, handle it in-game.
 
RiddickDale said:
I'm just putting it out there.

I was the elf fighter in a green and black tunic with an oddly shapped green and black shield.

If I ninjad your kill. Let me know with a PM. I'm serious.

Stephen


You never ninja'd me kill, Stephen... you only ninja'd me. :thumbsup:
 
Ezri said:
That being said, kill stealing is an in-game issue and should be handled as such. This isn't WoW where you can set loot rules, nor do I ever want it to be.

This!
I sucks to be a little guy and to do what you think is a lot to something and have someone come along and toss in 2 hits and take it, but it happens. That 20th level guy thinks that he was protecting you because his 1 hit is equal to 5 of yours so he may not even think about it. Or, his character is an *** and he doesn't really share unless you make him. It's how it goes, it's how the game works. The little guys are given opportunities to get treasure too, there are lowbie mods. Honestly, most people err on the side of "give it to the green adventurer".

If someone isn't, take it IG. Treasure disputes are not for the staff and they are not for the IG nobles, they are for the characters to figure out themselves. If there is a guy who follows you around, loots your kills then strong arms you when you stand up to him, then just look at him and say "Damnit Riddick!", that should work. ;)

I think it's really rare for someone to trully be OOG player bashing with the looting. I also think sometimes new guys don't understand why someone loots a kill that they hit, this weekend I did see some instances where a little guy was hitting me and a big guy rolled up and gasses/spelled me down. The little guy then looted and the big guy explained why he did more to "buy the kill". I know when you are new you might not get that your 5 2's don't equate to the guy who popped in and tossed 3 vertigo gasses, but ask the guy IG.

This was a tough weekend for "kill stealing", as is any low-NPC weekend. Everyone wants to fight and everyone wants a piece of the treasure bucket, so when 15 guys descend on 3 NPC's, the 1st level guy isn't going to get his day in the sun and he's not going to get anything unless the big guys share.

Mike - you have the power to fix this from monster desk! ;) If you want your little guys to get some treasure and to feel cool, hook some lowbie mods or send out some reverse threshold creatures, write a plot line that somehow targets the new guys...

Lowbiebasher hates adventurers, but he isn't able to take on the big guns. Lowbiebasher stumbled on an ancient ritual that was used by the dragons to rid themselves of small nuicencesses. He figures if he gets rid of all the new adventurers, the old ones will eventually die off and they'll become extinct.

Lowbiebasher casts the ritual and new creatures bow to his every whim. "Kill the adventurers of Fairdale!" he screams.

An army of shambling mounds of bluish tinged moss creep out into the world, slowly shifting form to appear as humans with a small blue patch of moss by the left eye. Immune to weapons and spells and even alchemical means, they enter the world...

As this summoning begins, the great dragon, Notadonut, hears it's words. To defend themselves from this threat he casts a ritual in defense marking all who have chosen the path of adventurer, but have yet to come into their own with a blue sigal allowing them to fight the legion of creatures sent to destroy them. So now, each adventurer under 5th level bears this mark and can fight this horde of creatures until the last one falls.


Or something way cooler than my crappy thing that gives the new guys something only they can do ;)
 
And it may not be as glamorus, but dishes pay very very well. At least its safe and doen't carry with it a chance of getting gooned. Safest three gold a newbie can make.

I'm doing my part.
--bill
 
For my two cents:

I think there has always been a time when the big guys will be able to do more damage and lay more claim to the kill. Hell, I've been playing this game for 12 years and I still run into that when I play my secondar and terciary (as they're both still low level.)

It happens. I've been literally shoved out of a fight by players who I KNOW are not bad players or player bashing, it just plays out that way sometimes. I also know that if I feel I've done a good amount of damage, no matter what I was swinging, I will chime in with "I want some of that" when the kill is searched. Nine times out of ten the other player will agree. I may not get the ritual scroll, but I'll at least get something out of it.

Some players/characters do not realize who may have been fighting the monster all that time. Some players may be really nice while his character is a **** *cough Scarn Whiteleaf cough*, but I genuniely feel that our PLAYERS aren't looking to **** other players.

With that said, plot does have the power to fix this. I know that there are lowbie specific mods that have been written and go out. I cannot encourage these strongly enough. It's a chance to go and feel awesome and have your 3s or 4s you're swinging not seem minimal, and makes you feel a lot cooler than during the wave battle when you're standing next to a guys swinging 20s.

Some responsibility is also no low level players: If you have a low level character and you're playing him/her, pre reg!! If Plot knows a bunch of low level players are attending, they may (and Should IMHO) plan a low level mod or maybe even two if ideas and NPCs are aplenty.

I've personally been on one such mod that Mike V. wrote, hooked and ran. It was a really neat twist and I really enjoyed. In fact, it may even be re-runable every few years...

Anyway...just my thoughts on the matter.

-Hoyce
 
Dude... Get a moderator to send you the banned words file. I lol'd for an hour just from the "c" section (see what I did there?)! There's 25 letters worth of words I didn't know were dirty left to explore.
 
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