Logistics and Character Rewrites

C

Cassandra

Adept
Hello Everyone!

As of April 1, the new rules went into effect. Logistically, what this means for you is that before the next time you play your character or until June 30 you can change your class and/or skills. Specifically (taken from the Alliance Seattle announcement section);

Because there are new skills, players will be allowed to … change your skills and/or class ONLY. You cannot change your race, character history, or anything else. You are still the same character with new skills.

To expand on this, we will be allowing one step class changes (templar to scholar etc).

If you wish to utilize this please use the following format when emailing logistics:

Player Name:
Character Name:
New Character Skills:
Removed Character Skills

And understand that I will be doing my best to process the requests as quickly as possible (keep in mind that the week before the May event is a busy time for logistics and it is my preference to have taken care of all requests prior to the end of the May Pre-reg date if you wish to make changes to your character and PC during that event)

All comments/questions/inquiries/rewrites please email me at logistics@alliance-seattle.com

Cheers
Cassandra
 
might i also suggest putting in you old class and new class so she does not have to guess what class you are moving to.
 
Renner said:
might i also suggest putting in you old class and new class so she does not have to guess what class you are moving to.
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Yes, that would also be extremely helpful!

Thanks Renner
 
Cassandra said:
To expand on this, we will be allowing one step class changes (templar to scholar etc).
Click to expand...
How the heck does that work? Let's say I'm a rogue. The "one step" idea would seem to imply I can only change to scout or adept. But what if, as my current rogue, I have a couple profs. I decide to rewrite and add on more profs, and drop all of my backstabs. Even if you force me to go scout, the Fluid Class system will automatically allow me to be a Fighter, since I would be spending less build, and not go into the negative.

Similarly, let's say I'm a scout with a couple profs, a couple back stabs, and a small spell tree. If I decide to drop my backstabs entirely (and not spend any points), I instantly become a templar, under the Fluid Class system. Then, I can spend my "free" points into more profs or my spell tree.

Why would you force me to rewrite into a class that I won't be staying in? Why require stupid logistics games to accomplish the same feat?

The whole point of the rewrite is "If these options had been available to me before, I would have done this differently!" Maybe we'd have fewer Earth casters if only there were more options available for Celestial. Maybe people that went templar would go rogue, scout, or adept.

What is an Artisan allowed to rewrite into? He's not any of the classes, and yet he's all of them.
 
Since my original desire was to allow no class change with the rewrite, the single step class change is a compromise. Once the rewrite is completed, then and only then can you use the fluid class system. This is to avoid people deciding they really wanted to play a scholar instead of the fighter they have been playing for the last 2 years and completely re-writing their character.
 
The trick is, just send in you want all of your build refunded, have 0 spent, and choose a class. Any class, really. Then just say "Okay, I want to spend this build, and end up as this class." Now THAT is pretty fluid. At least in my book.
 
Brad Lewis said:
The trick is, just send in you want all of your build refunded, have 0 spent, and choose a class. Any class, really. Then just say "Okay, I want to spend this build, and end up as this class." Now THAT is pretty fluid. At least in my book.
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I got to agree with Brad here, it would be entirely to easy to stay whatever class you are or shift one and then just sped a minimum of your build on skills that you really want for the class you really want. Then use the fluid class system to achieve the class you want and have the rest of your build be available for the new class.
 
The thing people seem to be missing is that you cannot change any skills when using the fluid class system. The only thing that changes is how much you have spent on those skills you already have. You then need teacher cards, etc., to buy any new skills you would be trying to get.

And Brads thing of saying you want all of your build refunded wouldn't work either, because it would be a clear violation of the spirit of the allowed change. So elt's try to stop working the system and try starting to make changes that actually make sense to the character?
 
Rewrite still means Rewrite, last I checked. If the national standard is "Complete rewrite, other than race," why try to limit just this chapter? Heck, if you really wanted to stand in the way of people making their characters the way they want them, why shouldn't they transfer theirs to another simply for the rewrite? Sure, it'd put extra strain on other chapters, but at least then their build would be where they want it.
 
The national standard is NOT complete rewrite other than race, though. It is specifically stated as not being so, and to limit the changes to only those that make sense for your character. Extreme changes were not and are not the goal of this.
 
So, if I was an Earth scholar because I decided that Celestial was lame, but now Celestial is cool, I'm hosed?

Rogues can't stay rogues and pick up Terminate since they don't have teacher cards? What about people that lost Evaluate? Nobody gets Merchant, since there is no teacher card for that yet either?

The thing people seem to be missing is that you cannot change any skills when using the fluid class system. The only thing that changes is how much you have spent on those skills you already have. You then need teacher cards, etc., to buy any new skills you would be trying to get.
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Sample card: Bob the Rogue, 18th lvl rogue 185build
R/W,Herbal Lore,Alch 3,Read Magic,First Aid,Healing Arts,Backstab x2,Dodge,Evade x2,Prof x2,Parry,Primary tree: 3/2/1,Secondary tree: 2/1,OHE,Stylemaster,Blacksmith,Legerdemain, teacher cards for 4th and 5th level primary tree.

With your version of the rewrite, I declare Scout. I drop all backstabs, evades, the dodge, alchemy, herbal lore, and legerdemain. Now I've spent 124 as a Scout, but fluid class allows me to automatically become a Templar, where I've only spent 90 build. Now I dump it all back into profs and an celestial tree, and end up with Blacksmith,OHE,Stylemaster,Parryx2,Profx6,R/W,RdMagic,FA/HA,5/4/3/2/1 Primary, 2/1Secondary, +1 free build floating.

So I went from Rogue to Templar, even though you seem to think I can't and shouldn't do it. Honestly, I have enough teacher cards from NPCing saved up that I could easily make the same change to straight up Fighter or Scholar without sweating it.

Fluid-class was designed to let players spend their build more effectively. With it in play, you can't dictate what class characters are allowed to change to.

If you want to say "No new skills unless you have teacher cards", I'm fine with that. But telling players they can't go from fighter to scholar is unnecessarily arbitrary and unsupportable.

Dave said:
This is to avoid people deciding they really wanted to play a scholar instead of the fighter they have been playing for the last 2 years and completely re-writing their character.
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"I want to pump out lots of damage, but Celestial kinda sucks... once I blow my spells, I'm done for the day. I guess I'll just go fighter."
"Well, my friend, look over here. We've heard your pleas, and have added Wands and High Magic! Now, as a Celestial caster, you can throw packets all over the place and do so much more with formals!"
"Yay! Thank you, Announcer-Guy! I want to be a celestial scholar!"
"Well, actually, under paragraph g6a, subsection 2, you CAN'T! MWUAHAHAHA!"*

*Feel free to replace this line with "Well, actually, because I don't want you to, you CAN'T! MWUAHAHAHA!

--silliness aside, it makes the most sense to treat this as a Spirit Forge. Still the same character, still the same motivations, but for whatever reason you want to create for the character, you got Forged. You can pick up new skills you have teacher cards for, and move on.
 
For the record, the only thing I changed on Daylynn was I removed wear extra armor as the only reason I had it was to use my 30 point Arcane Armor that I have.

With the new Scout limit on armor being 30 points. I never would have gotten it in the first place.
 
Direct quote from Mike V on the national boards reguarding this topic when he announced it:

"Because there are new skills, players will be allowed to Spirit Forge their characters. This means you can change your skills and/or class ONLY. You cannot change your race, character history, or anything else. You are still the same character with new skills.

This is not an opportunity for powergaming, and players who decide that this is perfect time to change from fighter to scholar will be strongly discouraged. This is meant to make it easy for you to say “Had I seen these rules before, I would have created my character in a different way.” Please, we really don’t want to see massive changes here."

This does not say "you may not do this" this says "anyone who does this is being cheesy so please don't be cheesy". If national had wanted it banned, they'd have explained it as such. This says you can if you want to, but we're encouraging people to stay true to their characters.
 
My build. I paid for it.

(Fwiw, I won't be doing any super drastic changes myself. Just making a point)
 
While I don't have a character here and I'm not making a "drastic" change on my character in my home chapter. I have to agree that "not allowing" a full change from Fighter to Scholar or something is NOT what was intended by the owners the the symposium.

Brad also makes a valid point. Just say you want all your skills removed. Then buy the basic skills at whatever the cost they would be of the new class you would want to be, and then just get taught all the new skills and Fluid class system into a new class.

While I respect the intent to not allow people to "cheese" the change it doesn't make any serious sense to try and actually "restrict" it.

And in addition it would be totally valid to just request a transfer to another chapter. Ask them to fully change your character to what you want, and then transfer it back.



Once again just my two cents. You guys had a great game and while I won't be able to get back in the near future sadly I definitely want to visit again! :)
 
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