Metal Breasplate

matrim1985

matrim1985

Scout
I was looking over different kinds of sheet metal and thus far am leaning towards cold rolled steel. I was planing to use a hammer and anvil and slowly, over several days, shape it. My only concern is that it may be to hard to work with so what do people recommend. I am really looking at heavier metals for that 3 point value.

I really don't have a whole lot of money for this and want the fitting to be right anyways so will be doing my own labor.
 
If you are looking at a 3 point metal thickness, then cold rolled will be the easiest to work with. However, there is a lot more involved with shaping the armor than just using an anvil and hammer. The easiest way to shape a breast plate is to use a technique called 'dishing'. It is where you have a circular depression, usually in a thick tree trunk, and hit the metal into the dish. I've also heard of someone using an old mattress so that there was more give. As you hit the metal, it compacts and becomes harder to work with so repeated hitting on an anvil makes it very difficult to use.

I'd suggest doing some more searches online.
 
Sand bags are also useful for dishing as you can shape them to whatever shape you want.

Also if the metal gets too hard to work you can heat it up and let it cool down again. This will make it softer but will add some scaling and discoloration. Since we're not fighting with real weapons you don't have to worry about other side effects of heating the metal. Just know that if you heat it you will need to clean and polish it, a car buffer works great if you have one.
 
Keep in mind also that if the metal is one piece (not banded or scaled or whatever, it's going to be less comfortable to wear in game especially if it has a back. I still remember the first time I tried to bend over to search a monster after getting my new metal breastplate.
 
markusdark said:
As you hit the metal, it compacts and becomes harder to work with so repeated hitting on an anvil makes it very difficult to use.
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It's not a matter of compaction -- as metal is worked it actually stiffens. That is why metal is reheated (annealed) which softens the metal and allows it to continue to be worked. All of this occurs on the molecular level (t0o small a level to allow any actual compaction). The metal is actually forming a stronger and stronger lattice of molecular bonds. Heating randomizes the molecules, breaking the molecular bonds in the developing latticework.

To experience this phenomenon - take a metal paperclip and bend it. Eventually the metal gets so stiff that it breaks, instead of bending. If you have a piece of heavy copper wire you can try the same thing - eventually the copper wire will become so stiff at the bend point that it will not bend any more at that point, and the pressure you apply to bend the wire will start to allow bending at a new location ... because the bend point has gotten too stiff. If you heat the copper wire, it will become flexible, again.

(You will also notice that the metal will get warm and then hot as you continue to bend it. This is because the bending energy is being converted to heat as you fight to try and move the molecules that are resisting the motion of bending -- a sort of friction.)
 
And the stronger bond is being caused due to the fact that you are compacting the molecules so that they have nowhere else to move. That's what working the metal does to it.
 
You're not really 'compacting' the metal, what you're doing is forcing the impurities to move, which allows the crystal structure to prevail in the bulk of the material. The impurities will be forced to grain boundaries, which, when stressed, will generally break much more easily than the bulk material. If you're using a material with very few impurities, the same thing will happen, except that where the crystal structure will force out the 'kinks' in the lattice to the edges, again allowing the proper crystal structure to prevail. This will make the material much harder because it's aligned in its lowest energy state (which will mean that the bonds are very difficult to break) but when they become stressed enough (say, if you hit them with a hammer or something) they'll break catastrophically rather than bend. (This is why, if you've got a set of really nice knives, they'll be very sharp, stay very sharp for a long time, and cut through all kinds of crazy things, but if you do something dumb like use one as a screwdriver they'll snap.)
 
obcidian_bandit said:
You're not really 'compacting' the metal, --CLIP--- but if you do something dumb like use one as a screwdriver they'll snap.)
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A very nice additional detail.

I once saw an episode of Nova about Samurai swords (katana), their contruction and their metalurgical and physiochemical properties. In it they had some really fine illustrations of these principles. They described the use of two kinds of steel -- which took a fine edge and the other which provide flexible strength which are combined to form a strong, springy spine with an ultrasharp edge. It was important that just the right amount of impurities (mostly carbon) be introduced with the iron at just the right times.

It's a fun watch, as well as very informative: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/samurai/

You might, also, wish to focus on the metalurgy at http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/samurai/vinci.html

Here are two very interesting "Q & A"'s:

Q: It seems paradoxical to me, but if you add defects to a metal, it gets stronger, right?

Vinci: Yes. The great thing about metal is that its atoms are able to rearrange relatively easily, using defects as a way of moving around, and this allows us to change the metal's form. And if we start to build up more and more defects, they start to distort the structure, and the atoms no longer move as easily. The result is we build up the strength. So this is another way that we can tune up the properties of the material, by controlling the number of defects that exist inside.

Q: So the number of defects actually determines how strong it is?

Vinci: Yes. If I take a piece of copper tube, for instance, it's relatively easy to bend it the first time. And if I were to install it in a home or business, I could straighten it out as needed. But if I make a mistake and try to change the shape of it again, it gets much more difficult to straighten it out the second time and even more difficult the third time. Because every time I bend it, I create lots of microscopic defects inside, and the more defects I have, the stronger the material gets.
 
The thing about the ancient art of samurai sword making is that they didn't have 20-21st century tech. In those days, Steel was made by introducing carbon into iron to strengthen it into steel. These days, you can get steel with different items other than carbon. The 'impurities' are alloying materials that turn iron into steel. To call them impurities though would be something akin to calling Hydrogen as an impurity in water.

These days, the alloying materials are much more properly mixed so that the overall product has the same strength, hardness and ductility from one point to the next. One of the reasons for the folding process was to create this since most ancient forms of steel making would result in varying degrees from one piece in the process to the next. I believe that in the PBS show, they showed the crafting of steel in the ancient form and after letting the material cool from the forge/furnace, they would separate the harder ore from the softer - even though they were all in the same batch.
 
Copper, Iron, Steel, Nickel, and other metals will have similar behaviors -- that's what makes them metals.

If you take a copper tube, an iron rod, or a nickel wire ... all will get stffer and stiffer at the bending point -- and for the same reason: it's a characterstic of being a metal.
 
I didn't think I was a nerd until I realized I know the two reasons that a person is not held accountable for their actions within the United Federation of Planets. :P
 
markusdark said:
I didn't think I was a nerd until I realized I know the two reasons that a person is not held accountable for their actions within the United Federation of Planets. :P
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I suppose one reason would be if such action is a violation of Federation Law, but would be a violation of the Prime Directive, in which case such violation would not be held against the person committing that act, unless otherwise provided for under Federation Law and General Orders.

What would be the other reason (I never went to Starfleet Academy, so I am only situationally familiar with Federation law).

:ugeek:
 
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