Character building

DPS fighter from Thorgrim's post in the other thread:

So lets give our fighter that much to work with in fighter abilities. They spend 54 build to get up to 3 profs and a base damage of 5. They purchase 100 crit attacks. This would allow them to swing 15's for a total of 100 minutes. They also purchase 7 eviscerates (lets say for the sake of argument these do 200 dmg against big bads) and 14 slay/improved slay (150 damage each) So that fighter per reset can do 1400 dmg from eviscerates and 2100 damage from slays. Lets also say our fighter is able to land 5 hits per minute in a normal combat (an extremely low estimate for a good fighter, but with the new flurry rule we will lowball it for the sake of argument). This means for the 100 minutes he can swing 15's he has a damage potential of 7500 from crit attacks. That's 11000 potential damage from fighter abilities alone and doesn't even account for the fact that the fighter can swing for 5's indefinitely.
 
Inaryn said:
Try respending with Shatter and Disarm instead. Their effectiveness in 2.0 is going to be *amazing*.
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I'm not sure about that. Shatters having to actually hit the target of shattering is going to lead to a lot of arguments on the field involving 'did that hit my weapon, my armor, my pouch, or my hand first?', even if everyone is playing as fair and even-mindedly as possible simply because it's difficult to parse in the middle of a scrum.

Draven said:
While Formals will still be useful for Cloaks/Banes/Rebirth/Arcane Armor, I'm not certain there's a lot of reason for any Formalist to have more than 15 Formals outside of some ritual casting, which is occasional at best.

Edit: Oh, and Magic Augment. Duh.
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With the Celestial Armor improvements, I think Celestial High Magic is strictly better than Earth Formal under the new system.
 
Muir said:
With the Celestial Armor improvements, I think Celestial High Magic is strictly better than Earth Formal under the new system.
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Completely agree. Celestial Armor now being cheaper and being able to go up to 40 is a significant boon for Celestial formal. It is more useful than the Earth equivalent of Earth's Bounty.

Although, Celestial does not have a 1:1 to Rebirth, yet. But I am not certain if Celestial needs one since Celestial already has more valuable Elemental Burst vs. Healer's Resolve on top of more valuable Celestial Armor vs. Earth's Bounty, not to mention Celestialists getting Wands effectively for free.
 
Muir said:
With the Celestial Armor improvements, I think Celestial High Magic is strictly better than Earth Formal under the new system.
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Yeah, absolutely.
 
Inaryn said:
So, at 352 build, which is roughly somewhere around where my primary is...
Wylderkin, Earth Templar:
Claws
Resist Command x4
Resist Poison x2
Herbal Lore
Merchant
Teacher (1)
Read/Write
Read Magic
First Aid
Healing Arts
One Handed Edged
Stylemaster
Blacksmithing 1
Crit Attack 10
Disarm 5
Eviscerate 1
Improved Slay 2
Slay 2
Parry 2
Riposte 1
Shatter 2
Alchemy 3
Create Trap 3
Stun Limb 2
Earth 4 column
Earth Formal 5
Celestial 1

Jack of all trades, master of none, but better than a master of one. ;)
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Nice build....but wheres your dodge? With the Alchemy and create traps it gives you enough points in "Rogue" skills to pick up dodge for 8 build i think
 
As with my friend above, I'm still relatively new. I am only LVL 13 and this would be Scarlett under the new rules:

LVL13 - Mystic Wood Elf - Artisan - 137bp - 17body/20 Armour

Craftsman(Various) - 11
Herbal lore
Merchant
Teacher - 3
Read & Write
First Aid
Healing Arts
One Handed Blunt
Blacksmithing - 20
Fast Refit - 3
Alchemy - 3
Create Trap - 3
EARTH - 4-4-3-1

LVL20 - Mystic Wood Elf - Artisan - 205bp - 24body/20 Armour

Break Command - 1
Resist Command - 1
Craftsman(Various) - 15
Creat Potion - 3
Herbal lore
Merchant
Teacher - 3
Read & Write
First Aid
Healing Arts
One Handed Blunt
Blacksmithing - 20
Fast Refit - 3
Alchemy - 5
Create Trap - 5
EARTH - 4-4-4-4-3-2-1

LVL30 - Mystic Wood Elf - Artisan - 305bp - 34body/20 Armour

Break Command - 2
Resist Command - 1
Craftsman(Various) - 15
Creat Potion - 3
Herbal lore
Merchant
Teacher - 3
Read & Write
First Aid
Healing Arts
One Handed Blunt
Blacksmithing - 20
Fast Refit - 3
Alchemy - 10
Create Trap - 10
EARTH - 4-4-4-4-4-4-4-4-3


I know the build seems strange, I play strictly a support character. The new rules don't really do much for my character. (Besides Fast refit and the healing storms of course) Over all in the new rules it's all focused on "How do we regulate the damage so everyone feels useful." or "Lets help the battle casters be more ballsy and let them get there spells back if they mess up." Unfortunately over all this kind of leaves the support characters out.
 
Muir said:
I'm not sure about that. Shatters having to actually hit the target of shattering is going to lead to a lot of arguments on the field involving 'did that hit my weapon, my armor, my pouch, or my hand first?', even if everyone is playing as fair and even-mindedly as possible simply because it's difficult to parse in the middle of a scrum.



With the Celestial Armor improvements, I think Celestial High Magic is strictly better than Earth Formal under the new system.
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It was absolutely very clear when they tagged targets at the last play test I participated in. It was the one skill I wish I had more of.
 
Gilwing said:
Nice build....but wheres your dodge? With the Alchemy and create traps it gives you enough points in "Rogue" skills to pick up dodge for 8 build i think
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Not sure if I have enough build for it at this time. ;)
 
Human fighter Lv 30 (315BP):

5- One hand Edge
6- Shield
3- Blacksmithing x1
150 - Critical Attack x50
33 - Weapon Prof x2
30 - Hearty x15
6 - Improved Slay x3
16 - Slay x8
24 - Parry x6
10 - Eviscerate x2
20 - Disarm x10
12 - Shatter x4

You have to micromanage your resources, but it's ridiculous fun if you like to tweak your gameplay situationally. I had an absolute blast at the last playtest with a build similar to this.
 
I also created an archer for another playtester. It was built more on today's style of play, with a prof-driven base and skills to support. He said it was enjoyable and effective, even with the reduction in max damage. I'll post the numbers when I have access to my gmail account later.

What I found interesting in particular was that we both had very different builds, but we were each able to own our respective niches with effective and fun play, and that no single build had a clear advantage over another. It was a really refreshing change from the current system, where one particular style of build dominates.
 
If the rules change hit tomorrow as they are currently this is what my fighter would become.

Barbarian (Oathsworn?) Fighter (125 build) - lvl 12
34 Body 20 Armor
15- Weapon Master
105- 5 profs
3- Blacksmith
2- Resist Fear

I like the idea of running around swinging a big number and having a dumb amount of body without any real toys to go with them. From my current Build I'm loosing both of my resist elements and a few other weapon skills but also taking advantage of the re-write to drop R&W and get my 5th prof. All in all not much different from my current card.

If I had it to do with a larger card( and some better armor reps) it would look something like this.
181 Build - lvl 17
62 body 30 armor
15- Weapon Master
10- Style Master
105- 5 profs
3- Blacksmith
4- Resist fear x2
12- Resist Element x4
10- Hearty x5
10- Resolute x2
12- Parry x3


It might not be fully optimized but its the best way I see myself enjoying things. Slays are nice but when it came down to it I liked the idea of having more body more than slays in their current form.
 
I'm still noodling what to do with my 30th level Celestial scholar, but here's what I do with my 25th level Rogue. As a bit of background, Silp is my character that I don't really care about magic items for. If I end up with them, cool, but if I lose them all, I don't bat an eye. The only item I care about having is my AA, and even if I lose that, that just means I'm more motivated to make myself some leather bark-like armor.

CURRENT RULES:
Silp - Dryad Rogue, 256 Build, 36 Body
One-Handed Blunt (4)
Resist Binding x 3 (12)
Read/Write (6)
First Aid (2)
Healing Arts (4)
Read Magic (6)
Merchant (1)
Blacksmith (4)
Earth 2-1 (6)
Archery (6)
Backstab x 9 (135)
Dodge x 4 (20)
Assassinate x 4 (12)
Terminate x 2 (8)
Riposte x 2 (10)
Stun Limb x 3 (9)
Disarm x 2 (4)
CO Stump Remover (2)
5 free

Currently, Silp swings 20s from behind with a single short mace, with a good chunk of combat toys and assorted other skills because I felt like it. Very effective in the chapter he plays in.

NEW RULES:
Silp - Dryad Rogue, 256 Build, 36 Body
One-Handed Blunt (4)
Resist Binding x 3 (12)
Read/Write (6)
First Aid (2)
Healing Arts (4)
Earth 1 (2)
Backstab x 5 (105)
Assassinate x 7 (7)
Improved Assassinate x 7 (14)
Dodge x 7 (35)
Stun Limb x 4 (12)
Terminate x 3 (12)
Back Attack x 16 (48)
CO Stump Remover (2) (Definitely an essential part!)
2 free

New Silp swings 12s from behind most of the time, with enough Back Attacks to swing 20s like he used to for ten minutes 4 times per day. Considering Silp has never really needed to swing 20s for longer than that at a time and already felt very powerful back when he swung 12s, that's fine by me. Rather than 4/day 90 Assassinate, he can now do 7/d 90 Assassinate, as well as has a 1 more Stun than before, 1 more Terminate than before, and 3 more Dodges than before (which is going to be crazy, since Silp is cautious enough that I've only ever used all 4 of my Dodges once, and that was only because it was the last mod on Sunday morning and I felt like burning them). A lot of assorted utility skills are gone, but they were mostly purchased because I had free build laying around. In short, New Silp is going to be very powerful, especially since his "magic item game" doesn't really change at all.
 
I was thinking of a hunter themed character that went for one big kill shot. I tried to build a fighter that focused on slay / improved slay. But at 7 of each I got stuck (I actually got stuck before that and had to start adding crits and profs) and ended up with 318 build whether you go fighter or scout.

RW 6/6
HL 6/5
THM 10/16
BS 3/3
Crit attack 33 (I didn't want this many based on the character concept but I had to start adding them to get a decent number of slays) 99/99
Disarm 5 10/10
Eviscerate 3 15/21
Improved slay 7 14/14
Parry 7 28/28
Riposte 3 15/15
Slay 7 14/14
Weapon prof 2 33/39
Alchemy 3 18/15
Counteract 4 24/12
Dodge 1 8/6
Stun limb 5 15/15


Funnily, the next dodge you buy makes scout the more efficient choice. But only a fighter can buy a second dodge. A fighter can buy a terminate but a scout can't. Where the character would go next while staying as close as possible to the kill shot artist is beyond me. Building out this concept was pretty complicated.

I think this character's slays with the two hander would be 135. Is that right?
 
As I was reading through this thread I notices that people were calculating Assassinate damage wrong, and then noticed that, no, the Assassinate damage formula wasn't included in the packet.

Slay damage is based on weapon base damage, but Assassinate damage is not, because it's supposed to represent a sudden attack to a vital area.

For what it's worth, please know that this is what was always intended for the new rules.

Assassinate does 25 damage in a single weapon attack that must be delivered drom behind or with a ranged weapon. Improved Assassinate inceases the damage of Assassinate by 25 damage per purchase. Thus Assassinate damage scales as: 25, 50, 75, 100, ... etc. In the same way that backstabbing is harder than using profs but carries a greater reward, Assassinates are harder to use than Slays but do far more damage.
 
My Assassinates per day under the new rules suddenly became 1400 points of damage in 7 swings? Yikes.
 
Gandian Ravenscroft said:
My Assassinates per day under the new rules suddenly became 1400 points of damage in 7 swings? Yikes.
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If you can get someone to not turn around in the time it takes you to swing 7 Assassinates plus whatever non-Assassinate swings ate mandates by whatever system we settle on (no chaining powerful blows, only one per three swing flurry, or whatever), then yes. In practice I think it's pretty unlikely someone will get off more than two before their target is no longer facing away from them or, you know, is straight up dead anyway. But yes, the intention was to have Assassinate always be stronger than an equivalent Slay, even from a Heavy Crossbow, because getting it off requires so much more finesse.

Although Archery Assassinate Meditate rogue is going to Be A Thing.
 
Dan Nickname Beshers said:
If you can get someone to not turn around in the time it takes you to swing 7 Assassinates plus whatever non-Assassinate swings ate mandates by whatever system we settle on (no chaining powerful blows, only one per three swing flurry, or whatever), then yes. In practice I think it's pretty unlikely someone will get off more than two before their target is no longer facing away from them or, you know, is straight up dead anyway. But yes, the intention was to have Assassinate always be stronger than an equivalent Slay, even from a Heavy Crossbow, because getting it off requires so much more finesse.

Although Archery Assassinate Meditate rogue is going to Be A Thing.
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What's an "Archery Assassinate Meditate rogue"? Meditate only lets you get spells back, it doesn't let you get Assassinates back.
 
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