Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth it?

A

Aven

Artisan
So a few of my friends and I are discussing the pros' and cons' of controlled spirit store for earth scholars. Here is what we got thus far:

Pros:
- Up to 12 charges (depending on how many deaths you have) so in essence up to 12 lives
- Immune to gift effects and certain spirit ritual effects (when your bottle is NOT on you)
- Includes: death spells, shatter spirit, arcane obliterate, etc.
- Great for ritual earth casters as it makes them immune to backlashes and flaws

Cons:
- Must have bottle on/touching you to receive a life spell
- Must have bottle on/touching you to rebirth
- Spirit reforms at bottle, if bottle is with enemy, that could be a bad thing
- Immune to ritual backlashes and flaws (even the positive ones)
- Possibly immune to empowerment ritual enhancements if your bottle is not with you in the casting (would need confirmation on this, speculating here)
- Need a trusted companion(s) to hold bottle, keep it safe, and be johnny on the spot to get you life spells

So I am curious, for those of you who have played an earth scholar or earth templar/adept AND were controlled spirit stored, what was your experience? Is it worth it? What things should someone know before making that decision?

Thanks,

Jessica
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Go with Regen. Less to worry about.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

The only thing CSS really has going for it is the immunity to obliterate. Other than that you're really taking a bigger risk, so if you don't make a habit of fighting things with obliterate abilities, CSS really isn't worth the hassle. As Gary says you can get a lot of the same benefits with a Regenerate and a few cloaks.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Immune to Obliterate and Shatter Spirit, as well as quite a few other ritual affects. But like others said if you don't fight things like that, or hordes of Death elementals often it's hard to justify it over Regen if you have a choice...
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

I always liked the idea thematically, what shows your trust for a friend more, than having them carry around your spirit? Plus it also allows limited sharing spirit linked items I believe ^.^
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Immunity to Shatter Spirit is nothing to turn your nose up to.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

It makes you immune to most rituals, and pretty much everything that ever gets thrown. Aside from everyone's favorites of Obliterate and Shatter Spirit, you're also immune to other 'throwable' rituals such as all of the Transforms, Banish to Other Plane, Reverse Life Force, Curse of Undeath, and of course Racial Transformation/Spirit Forge (which I've only ever seen thrown offensively once).

Biggest problem I had with it (I had one, but on a fighter) was not having spirit linked items. Being on a mod and having everyone there play 'who has the bottle' is another significant concern, there will be times where you get separated from it, sometimes across camp, but assuming that you're diligent and just in town having lunch, it's not usually an issue. What becomes a bigger problem is when you're on a mod with a group of people, and both you and the person with your bottle are Dead. I ressed once for that when I otherwise would have been Lifeable.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Immune to any rituals and flaws that target the spirit if you're not in contact with your bottle.

That's huge as a ritualist.

I'm looking for a CSS instead of a Regen for that reason. I'll make my bottle a Life item (I'm fine making it times ever if that's all I can get) and possibly putting other rits on it so that whoever has my bottle has cloaks/banes/AA/PA whatever.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Dreamingfurther said:
Immune to Obliterate and Shatter Spirit.
Click to expand...
RiddickDale said:
Immunity to Shatter Spirit is nothing to turn your nose up to.
Click to expand...
Last I heard shatter spirit is still a LCO effect and not all chapters use it. But immune to obliterate isn't too shabby, I just don't know any chapters that throw those regularly.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Technically, yeah, Shatter Spirit is still LCO. Kind of like how "Extraplanar Creature" is technically an LCO class of monsters but most chapters use it. Or "Massive" as a carrier has different rules in many chapters because it's LCO.

It's a great example of an effect you'd want to be immune to, whether or not it's in the book or just used by a whole lot of chapters as LCO.

/off topic.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

I mentioned Shatter spirit because the OP plays in several chapters where Shatter Spirit is used liberally (CT and NH specifically).

I probably should have mentioned that in my post.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Yes, I should clarify my position...

My character, an earth ritualist, is probably killing blow active or shatter spirit active for some major bad guys up in Deadlands. In fact, if one particular type of bad guy would killing blow my character it acts as an oblit. In fact it just doesn't seem like it is a normal event if my character is not somehow back packing someone that is fighting against an active shatter spirit (both via spell or weapon blow) Void carrying mofo. So far I have been successful at preventing the person I am backpacking from getting that shatter spirit. And so far they have done a great job preventing that shatter spirit from hitting me instead. But you never know when it can happen.

Here is my concern. For the prevention of shatter spirit alone (or in case I get banished to the deep, you know crazy stuff like that), having a CSS is the bomb. Who wouldn't want to get that. However it then requires that I always have with me someone competent AND able to carry my bottle. What I mean by this is that I need someone that has the game knowledge to pretty much do what it takes to get to me and life me but also has the means in which to do that. For me I have a great team and fortunately have people that fit that bill. But they do not always play when I do. And more importantly they cannot always come on the same modules that I go on. So therefore I could find myself in trouble.

If I do not keep my bottle on me, then I cannot use a rebirth. A rebirth for a earth scholar is your failsafe, if **** breaks down, you have a possible option of an out or at least a clock reset. Holding onto my bottle defeats the purpose of being immune to the shatter spirit/oblit.

And even though the Deadlands have upped their game and it is even more crazy dangerous there with being KBA with shatter spirit, we have an end game plan for that plot line. We are looking at trying to wrap that up and when we are successful at implementing the solution then in about 1.5 years I shouldn't (theoretically) be KBA to those nasties.

Since I do not have a CSS right now, I am trying to determine if it is worth going after that vs a regen for the possibility of having immunity when I really would only need that for 1.5 to 2 years.

I think it would be more of a pain in the butt then it would give me a benefit considering how long I would need that benefit.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Personally, I think that you are regularly surrounded by brilliant players. So I don't know that I would consider the fact that you would need someone else to hold your bottle to be a weakness.

I think you should also consider scarcity. If you have a chance at a CSS now vs the chance to maybe someday theoretically get a regen (or the opposite), then I think that would factor in as well.

Stephen
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

You can always bottle yourself, and if you don't feel there's a danger of being hit by an Oblit or SS, you can just carry the bottle. Other options are:

-To not extend the ritual, making it only 1 year, and try to speed up your timeline.
-Preserve it, and when you feel comfortable, carry it yourself. Then it's just like being regenned. Or, if you really don't like the idea of it any more, you can always Destroy it and try to find a Regen. (Gebous might have a coronary at the cost of that, though. His poor Hobling brain just wouldn't be able to handle it.)

I've also seen people who are CSSed hand the bottle to someone else going on the mod, then back to the regular carrier once back in town. You're the Oracle and one of the most competent battle healers I know. It's in everyone's self-interest to see you live through those mods! Plus, if different people carry it on the mods, it's less likely the BBG will know who has it, so long as it's something small and discreet that can clip to a belt (for easy removal for putting against you to Life you or let you Rebirth).
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

As others have said, if you're going with a preserve, sounds like CSS is the winning choice.

If you're going with a permanence, then not so easy. CSS has a few things going for it - less demand than regen so cheaper. And the immunities are cool. But more risk with it being tougher to get lifed and all that. If your character doesn't have a preference one way or the other, then consider how many deaths on your card. If you've never taken a death, then a CSS isn't all that dangerous because you afford a few. If you've taken 8 deaths than regen starts looking better.
 
Re: Controlled Spirit Store for Earth Scholars - is it worth

Or you can buy back all you're current deaths (assuming those deaths weren't taken while regend or css), and then regen or css yourself with the full 10 deaths available still.
 
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