Distribution of found goods as a town

Pokethulu

Pokethulu

Fighter
Public Relations Committee
Greetings fellow adventurers both; who have been here prior and those who have not,

I apologize for not clearly stating our policies for treasure distribution during town endeavors. I meantion this so that going forward there are no further misunderstandings or miscommunications.

When we as a community adventure for the betterment of the town, we gather all goods and coin found on such endevours and then split that take equally.

I was, do to personal reasons not able to provide a bag and name a bag person, to that end I apologize to those who did not recieve any share.
Reagents, gold, silver,copper, production and magic items are held and split equally. We sell reagents for 2 gold if they travel and 1 gold if they are tied closely to the land.

Going forward during town endeavors if you find anything it will be turned in and divided.

This is how we work as a community, this is not up for debate.

Lady FallingStar
 
Lady Fallingstar,

Respectfully, vhat authority is this proclamation done under? Does it apply to your lands, where you may make laws and regulations, about 3 days north of where zee adventurers meet? Or does your authority extend over Duchess Fairfax's fief? Iz this for adventures you personally lead, or for adventures where people travel into your lands? I am seeking clarification for legal reasons.

I agree zat some generally accepted procedures for handling treasure do work best and in fact have supported such sharing/auctioning of "big ticket items" such as formal magic scrolls and items of power, for a long time, even before it vas a popular concept.

Zat said, while vee generally agree on zee base principle, zee gathering every copper piece is a tedious time consuming task vich takes swords and spells away from ze problems zis land faces by taking 3 hours to evenly split everything down to zee coppers to ensure "fairness" instead of quickly working things out to be roughly equitable zhen turning our heads to zee next problem. Better to have a good grasp on zee important pieces of treasure zhan to argue over a few bits and baubles like a cure light wounds potion or two no?

Last question....you mentioned zat this vas not debatable... did you mean zat it's illegal to disagree vith you? If so, please accept my withdrawal of my comments although im sure no knowing zee law is no defense against it. Or did you mean zat zis is part of some adventuring charter written down in zee arborian library for anyone's perusal...? I am confused and seeking clarification.

Many Thanks,

Jehan T. Wyldweaver
Blood of zee Rom, Herald of zee Djinn
Marutian Apprentice of zee Celestial Guild
Warden of Truth
All around decent, if not overly patient, guy.
 
Lady Fallingstar,

Cyn and I had a very nice conversation about how to try and make this more stream line. Here are a few ideas the would quicken the count and put the responsibility of the to get "your fair share" on the adventurer.

1. We craft a board in town for adventures to track which activities they took part in. While this would be a great way to show of the good we do I would be concerned that this type of documentation could be use in a negative way by other as it would be view of all.
2. I have also thought of making a number of list ahead of the market to help us track who went on the adventure and just add or subtract from that list.
3. I was thinking of crafting simple wooden disk that can be collected and have the name and affiliation of the adventure. This would make it easier to collect and it would be the adventures responsibility to toss in there chip if that had participated in that action. The chips could be collected at the beginning or end of the adventure in a bag with the loot. This would give an count of those involved without a permanent record and allow fair distribution of shares as the chip would be returned with the share. For those that cannot read they can add a symbol to the back to know which is theirs.

I am willing to try and do one of these for August if the community is interested.

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~Captain Aramis Seablade
 
I really like the idea of the chips. Everyone should have two or three though in case we need to move on from a loot split before its finished. How hard would it be to make them? Can we make extras for people that lose them while adventuring? Can we mark them at the gathering with ease so new adventures can participate in this?

I would be willing to add some coin to the pot to get these chips made (OOG, I will kick someone some cash if this happens).

Fredrick Crawford - Saturnian Journeyman of the Solar Guild of Wayside
 
I am glad that we are discussing this often maddening topic at long last in a helpful and creative light. If we go the way of the chips. I would like to offer my assistance as I can easily have available the tools needed to quickly mark up new chips at my Apothecary. (OOG I can bring my dremel, paint, permanent markers or whatever and make new ones as needed at site.) I would suggest that we really only need this system for quests that require the majority of the town. I think this might be needlessly cumbersome for the smaller quests.
Would matching and easily identifiable loot bags help with this endeavor? Personally, I never have a free bag on my person...so many elixirs...

-Arsita
 
Jehan,

What Lady Fallingstar has explained is part of a previously discussed agreement of the adventuring community, established a year or so ago, with your assistance, to reduce the amount of items swiped from the loot right under our noses.

I Am not sure how you could have forgotten after putting up such a fuss over it.

With disappointment,
Eldandiril
 
I have a few vials and a couple scrolls (battle magic) I found on random things that I would happily throw in with the town.
When I asked someone local about it, they said not to worry about it.
Frankly I haven't checked into what the vials are. I believe the scrolls were reflect magic.

~Ahlana
 
I agree with Jeyhan. That is the way we split treasure but you only really have control of the adventurers as much as they agree with you. If someone has a better idea, or any idea, you should listen to them.

Lightning
 
Well, I forsee problems with theft all over again. As it was a huge problem before, so shall it be again.

This just looks like an opportunity for some towns members to stand against Lady Fallingstar to me. Which frustrates me to no end.

Risking life and limb and loosing people dear to you is not enough for this place it seems. Like something changed and there are some of us treated as though we are made of spines and barbs.

We have done what works and which has been endorsed by area nobles for a year or so now and suddenly these methods are changing, right after a slew of petty thefts. How convenient.

I know that you all want to get your shares and are pretty treasure oriented, or have been stolen from, but keep in mind that we have found something that works aND has for a while. Changing it now will take another year and by then I am sure we will all just be keeping what we find and not sharing at all.

The concept of a bag person can make some one feel as important for collecting if they do not feel adequate in other combat aspects. There are many positive things to see with a centralized collection.

There will still be those that steal, and sometimes blatantly, but at this point when we have an established system that works, we need not try to change it, just because Lady Fallingstar reiterated what had been previously agreed upon.

I am even sure it might be written down at the Fairfax Keep somewhere.

With disappointment,
Eldandiril
 
Lightning scores two points for zee concept of populous plurality!

Dear Disappointed,

Zee enforcement of a "gentleman's agreement" among adventurers from a year or so ago is improbable in zee light of zee constant growth, and unfortunate attrition, of zee group as a whole. Zee only way to ensure such an agreement continues to stand is to get others to buy into it as they arrive in town. Zat is the way to get people to self police and zat is also the honest thing to do.

Stating a past agreement as though it vere established law and/or unacceptable to refine is, as it vere, disingenuous and misleading and vill of course lead less people to join our cause or simply to ignore zee established concept in favor of their own opinion. I'd much prefer people engage in such discussion, feel free to challenge it a bit and gain zee chance to understand vhat we do and why we do it and to give new commers a chance to "own" this agreement and buy into it too.

Vithout a Knight, Magistrate, or local nobility making such an edict law....it's still at its base, an unenforceable agreement, but a fantastic discussion point vhivh many of those new to these lands could feel a part of rather than being told "this is how we do thing! no discussion". I vould welcome discussion, because discussion begets buy in.

Onto zee main points of discussion:

I for one, strongly support zee sharing of treasures of note: Items of power, formal scrolls, catalysts, etc and maybe, if pushing it, components because zhey can be done swiftly, fairly, and without too much fuss most of zee time. Of course, if zee vox populi vish to truly dig into zee coppers and disarms scrolls...so be it, I'll share happily down to zee least potion or elixir with my comrades. On zee other hand, unless given force of law, I vill not enforce such a concept so stringently myself as I simply don't care to. Of course, others are welcome to shake each other down over copper.

You stated:
"The concept of a bag person can make some one feel as important for collecting if they do not feel adequate in other combat aspects. There are many positive things to see with a centralized collection."

Zis is a very good point, and one I don't have a very good answer to. I think it does, if people trust zee town "bag person" and trust zee town to split things equitably...I don't see anything wrong vith having a designated bag person.

You also stated:

"I know that you all want to get your shares and are pretty treasure oriented, or have been stolen from, but keep in mind that we have found something that works aND has for a while. Changing it now will take another year and by then I am sure we will all just be keeping what we find and not sharing at all."

No, I am not pretty treasure oriented and I am fairly certain many vould disagree with that assessment or your exclusion from it, I was in my past, but now I find my needs are fairly well taken care of. As for changing or altering or even discussing better alternatives, i feel zee need to point out zee logical trap for you in your appeal to tradition. Still, I think zee people here would welcome your and lady fallingstars opinions as you have been at this a long time and your opinion undoubtedly vould be taken into account with roughly zee same weight, if not more, than most.

Change need not be a bad thing, nor need it take years of effort, nor need it change all zat much. No one is proposing much in zee way of a change...simply balking at zee concept zat there is to be no improvement to be made, or room for discussion with an imperfect status quo. Zat if anything, should disappoint you not Cyn, Aramis, Arsita, and Frederick vanting to discuss it more in depth...if anything zhey might find either a: a better solution, or b: find zat the current solution is still zee best one.

Cheers,

Jehan T Wyldweaver
 
I think the issue lies with the fact there is nowhere one can easily access an agreed upon set of rules. Personally, I do not trust anyone when I hear multiple ways of splitting treasure as a whole. As I have said before, trust issues.

I think this needs to either A. be discussed as a town at one of the markets, having AT LEAST one member from each major group to share their wants and beliefs or B. be decided by the highest power in Wayside after everyone gives input. Those seem like the fairest ways, though the latter may have some worried due to the fact that some adventurers have sway over said power. I mean no disrespect, but those of us new to adventuring do not know many of the nobles and such.

Additionally, splitting treasure on a smaller level should be the group's decision. While, yes, it's easier to have some sort of by-laws to dictate entire town adventures/missions, small groups have an easier time discussing their wants and needs. Therefore there needs to be a distinction between town and group adventurers.

If the process put for by Lady Fallingstar is written somewhere I think it is necessary to post it for all to see and define the consequences for not following them, if there are such consequences. I just know there are many who do not care sometimes about if they get a share.

My group and I were toying around about a town bank of some sort, maybe put someone at Fairfax Keep in charge of it? Basically all the gold and items that isn't distributed or is difficult to distribute evenly and fairly are put in the bank. Then either A. the gold and items can be distributed equally or B. they can be fed back into the local economy in order to promote growth and to help the local communities. Many times this past market I kept hearing reminders and people talking how many of the citizens of Wayside are still distrusting of adventurers, would it not be beneficial to us as a community to help those who need help? The philanthropy would be a good image booster and it is likely in times where we need help in the future it'd be easier to find those to help.

Just my two coppers, I agree there needs to be some rules (but agreed upon and posted for all to see),

Wild Rose
Owner of the Wild Rose Adventuring and Trading Company
 
This is just the sort of argument I was hoping would start up the first time I was unable to make a gathering. As the local Barrister I feel I should clarify a few points. Due to the change in legal standing of Lady Fallingstar and Zanabanath in recent times, neither of them currently have the authority to dictate such matters. Like myself Lady Fallingstar's authority is limited to the boundaries of her lands and anything beyond that is a matter of courtesy not law. That said for large town gatherings it has become the common practice to have a bag holder for items of note, from Components to magical items or scrolls, not generally production items. This helps to ensure incentives both for those who often hold themselves in the back only to step in when absolutely required (such as myself, it it not a dishonorable position) This often includes both healers, and powerful warriors who avoid standing in the front line at all times to ensure that others have the ability to test their skill and train against foes. By allowing the production to be kept, the younger adventurers who often sweep the edges of the field or protect the flanks against the weaker foes, gain a bit more coin and resources, which in general they often need a bit more coin and potions etc. to keep themselves in fighting shape while they lack the resources of the older adventurers.

Eldandiril,

I feel you need to calm down and back off this issue slightly, it is not an attack to note that Lady Fallingstar does not have authority she does not have. Your passion is commendable, albeit a bit odd for someone who fights so fervently for friends, family and principles. I saw your calling out of a new adventurer, it seems to be an honest mistake, but even if it was not I would have suggested you handle the issue privately at first, and then taken the issue to Squire Siril, or Sheriff Tetz and I feel your emotions might be getting the best of you in this situation.

Wild Rose,

A town 'bank' or box is an idea that comes up often, has been tried and has had many, many missteps in the history of our town, and has generally ended up having the feeling of a slush fund, regardless of who was in charge of it. This includes a period of time when I tended to the accounting and dispersed things only under the guidance of others. I would also strongly dissuade any idea of charity by demand or rule, there are a number of very significant initiatives already and unfortunately the average person will not be aware of anything outside their area, only of the larger actions of the adventurers in civil wars and the like. If you wish to assist the common folk, I'd suggest you talk to Squire Siril, Good Woman Zanabanath, Myself, or Goodman Wildweaver for ideas. Alternatively the Local Earth Guild would be a great source of ideas on how to do so, you can talk to Circle Master Marsters if you would like a local contact with them.

To all,

Lightning has a good point, any policy will only be as effective in as far as it's agreed upon, While chits may be slightly useful I don't think the tracking of who went on what is the major issue here, and adding a step with chits is likely to end up adding work and being no more effective than the current system. If people would like I think we should continue to discuss this and reconfirm the existing system at our next town gathering where we can make sure everyone has a chance to voice any objections. If you have an objection or concern, and do not feel like you wish to share it because of likely response or pressure from others, please let me know privately and I will raise the issue with the town for you so it can be considered. It is always good to revisit agreements that are not upheld by an authority to ensure all those you wish to be beholden to it have their chance to voice their opinion of it, after all if I and Jehan agree to have biscuits for lunch, it would be foolish of us to demand that Silp eats anything but his meat logs.

Regards,

Lord Barrister Enan Bluewater,
Keeper of the Azure Keep
 
Enan,

The reason I see this a a personal attack on Lady Fallingstar, is that multiple times during the market gather, Jehan openly disrespected her and then challenged her directly that she may not have the authority. She was not dictating it as law, merely speaking again of an established method in which we use.

Also, yes I called out Wild Rose for an apparent theft. It was brought to the attention of Squire Foss on Friday night and I felt that despite it being with in the noble sights it was still handled inappropriately. Wild Rose and I will discuss later on this matter and he has explained himself in the other portion Of the dreaming.

My emotions are mine to wield, and as we have discussed before, I am good at wielding Them. I have a mountain on my back as of late and though I do not wish to make any excuses, perhaps what we spoke about in Arden actually does hold true as I am too emotional to be any sort of focuSed... apparently.

Jehan,

This is not all about you, but thanks.

All,

If you all wish for me to bow out of any and all conversation pertaining to fairNess as I am no longer a noble and have no push even amongst so called friends. Perhaps I will save my people and then rid myself from your lives.

If you need me, I will be at Fairfax manor plotting my next home And the welcome party that will surely await me elsewhere.

With heavy disappointment,
Eldandiril
Party Planner
 
We could do this in a very simple fashion in my opinion, All attending a quest/adventure sign up on a roster type sheet before embarking on the quest that way we already know how many we are splitting the coin with at the end of the auction. Then hold the auction like we normally do at the end of the journey and split the coin quickly since we already know how many participants to split it between. 20 adventurers signed up for the quest, gold total after auction was 28 gold so 28 divided by 20 and the payout commences. Shaves all that time off of tallying up who came at the end and waiting for the final count to come in and then splitting. It just more streamlined.

-Corvo
 
My solution is of course for the streamlining of the auction itself and turning a long draw out process into a shorter one, I care not about the debate going on here. Just trying to get my coin quicker.

-Corvo
 
Not going to add to much at this time- as I have a great many things calling my attentions.

I am having a strong yet light and secure wicker backpack made as we speak- it should be be big enough for most loot or a day of loot. I in no way need to carry or be responsible for it but I offer it to use of the town in general. I can also produce smaller bags to store it it that can be written on and in for each adventure... Names loot and such can be listed and secured in the smaller bags in the bigger bag till distribution.

Just a thought. Not matter what the wicker bag will be in town and I can quickly make a large number of smaller bags and provide guilt and paper inside of it to be used by the "bag collector"

All I ask is the at the end of market day it is returned to me so I may use it between markets.

Perhaps the make lists of people present at each adventure easier... We make several copies of master lists of those in attendance that market and mark of one list who was in the group and stick in the small bag to be split later...

In Service,
Cyn
 
This has gotten out of hand. From the get-go this topic was approached as a conflict and argument, not a discussion or conversation. It is outbursts and bickering like this that makes people hesitant to trust senior adventurers. Their lives are just as threatened when they embark on these quests. We all bleed together. We all make mistakes, and we all let emotion get the better of us at times. Speak with the less experienced adventurers, not at them. Show your wisdom by explaining your position and why you feel it is best, rather than dictating it as unyielding law.

So please, let this be as it should: a discussion as to improve dividing the spoils and ensure everyone gets their just reward. People have put forth some interesting ideas. Leave what has been said in the past, and focus on the topic at hand.

I feel that side adventures should be handled however the group sees fit, but for town wide endeavors an agreement must be made. I think loose coin and production items can be left to those who found them. Potions and components, on the other hand, should be highly encouraged to be turned in. I am unsure about where battle scrolls should lie as I myself do not know their coin value. The key point that in the past hasn't been an issue but this most recent market day which made everything easier, was someone recorded the list of participants before departure. Returning to that procedure would be a start to improving the treasure division.

May your hearth fire burn eternal and your tankard endless,
~Draco Ardel
 
Now I's a simple man. When we're talkin' 'bouts loot on a'ventures are we's talkin' 'bout coin an whats found on the beasties?

cuz in heat uv battle I ain't gots time to be scouring every bloody corpses fer coin. and if in I's do get a bref to check one, wat ever I's find just falls in to me bag an are fergotten as the next beastie bears down on me.

I don't wants to accused of stealin. But I pro-miss if in I finds anything uvther then coin I'll turns it over to the "dually dess-ig-nated auctioneer"
But if in it's jus coin I can't pro-miss to turn over an acurate count.

thats all i'm sayin.

Yours faithfully
Grimshaw.
 
I agree with Draco, this has gotten well out of hand.

First of all, no one other then someone of a Knights position or higher has any right to "dictate" how we adventures split treasure. With that said we should all as a community figure out a way to settle this. At the end of the day, if you pitch in, you get a cut. That is how it should be.

As it has been a custom here for some time. Items of power, ritual scrolls, catalysts, and components are shared among those who participate in a endeavor. If it is a small number of adventures, then it is between them. If it is a town endeavor, we all share in the spoils. With that said. I'm not going to ask that every coin and potion is turned in. But I think we need to get back to the bag person. Someone the town trusts to hold all of the shared spoils. Then afterwards, we do our auction and everyone makes a few gold. It isn't that hard.

Yes, we had a lot of adventures in town. We did a lot of good for the people of this land, and at the end of the day, for me at least, is what it's all about.

But I like gold as much as the next guy, so here is my proposal.

Starting next Market. I would like two Volunteers. One Volunteer to hold the bag (that I'm asking Cyn to make), and One volunteer to handle the names of those who go. Then any Components, Ritual Scrolls, Catalysts, or Item of power found go into the bag. Then we do the auction and get paid. It is really that simple.

My way may not be the best, but I think this will work because it has worked in the past.

I would ask at this time this matter be publicly closed. If anyone has further issues or questions, contact me privately and I will do my very best to help.

Thank you,

Squire Foss Siril of Wayside
 
I am all for the previous split procedure, and the new one presented by Squire Foss, and I will be happy to do my part to make sure it works yet again on the bigger volunteer journeys. I look forward to the proof that the trust of the people in this system is well-founded.

Biff Sterling, Adventurer... AT LAAARGE!!!
 
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