Earth Carrier

Vryan

Vryan

Rogue
Alliance General Manager
New Hampshire Staff
I don't have a rulebook, and I need to check, if you swing something like 4 earth does an undead take double that damage? I know they take double from other earth things, like healing, but do they take double damage from Earth carriers? If not, then what's the point of earth as a carrier then?
 
If I'm not incorrect the only thing in the game that Undead don't take double from that has "Earth" in the verbal is an Earth Storm, and that one exception does make sense to be the way it is.
 
Angrydurf said:
Most standard undead take double from earth either carrier elemental or spell based.
Click to expand...

I'd just like to emphasize the "Most standard undead..." part. There are undead that do not. Whether that be for non-standard, ritual or plot reasons. But for those rares you can and will most certainly FOIG.

--Chazz
 
If an undead takes 30 points of damage from a Cure Mortal Wounds, they either have a notation like "Takes half damage from Healing Spells" or they're cheating. (Or the rulebook is written wrong, I suppose)

If an undead card has "takes double from Healing", they should be taking 120 from Cure Mortal Wounds, since, per the description of the spell, it does 60 points already.
 
I dunno. I hear ya but I kinda like the "takes double from healing" on a monster card. I find it serves as a nice reminder to all NPCs playing such a card. Many cards have that wording from older DBs or ones that haven't been changed for whatever reason. Now if it were to say "takes quadruple from healing" that would be a different story.

It doesn't hurt to have redundant reminders. Especially for NPC's. Thats a lot of cards one has to come close to memorizing before they use it.

--Chazz
 
Yea, I thought there was even something mentioning somewhere that although many undead cards say: "Takes double damage from healing" that is meant as just a reminder. And they aren't supposed to take 120 damage from a Cure Mort...

Now toss in a little Destruction and your set to go. ;)
 
If it's "just a reminder", then they shouldn't take double from earth auras. Either the rulebook notations need to be stricken out, or the monster card should read "Takes double from Earth carrier", imo. Telling a new player "Yes, double from Healing means you take double from Earth auras, but if it's a healing spell, just take double the amount it would heal, not double the amount of damage that the rulebook says you take" is just confusing. And when you get a monster card that says "Undead", but doesn't say "Takes double from healing", you're having to tell the new player "I know it says Undead take 60 pts from CMW, but really, you only take 30. No, it's not on the card, just trust me."

Flamebolt doesn't say "does 40 pts of damage to ice elementals". Why say "CMW does 60 pts to undead" if we're going to put "takes double damage from Healing" on the card?
 
You have me curious. Can you cite an example of such a monster? At least a relatively standard one?

I am just trying to understand here. Why not have it just say "takes double from Earth"? Wouldn't that cover both the "Earth" carrier and "I call upon the Earth".Then you would still have to clarify Earth Storm I guess, I just don't see that as being that big. At least not with all the other clarifications one does during an event anyway.

The reminder as I see it is for when you are jumping between things like undeads to Bone Golems to Panthergasts. All similar makeup requirements and only one "takes double from Earth." I see what you are trying to get at but I can't say I have ever heard an NPC ask,"hey I read that undead take double from Earth already, does this mean I take 4x damage?"

--Chazz
 
Chazz said:
You have me curious. Can you cite an example of such a monster? At least a relatively standard one?
Click to expand...
Chaos elementals, off the top of my head. Some cards I've used say "damaged by Healing", some say "takes double damage from Healing". Since there's no rule saying "CMW does 60 vs Chaos elementals", it's easy enough to understand: you take 30, or 60, respectively.

At least not with all the other clarifications one does during an event anyway.
Click to expand...
Fewer = much betterer. :)

I see what you are trying to get at but I can't say I have ever heard an NPC ask,"hey I read that undead take double from Earth already, does this mean I take 4x damage?"
Click to expand...
Not phrased that way, but I pretty often hear "So, do I take 60 or 120?" (or some variant) from new players.
 
Probably part of the reason the rulebook specifically mentions that Undead take 60 from a Cure Mort and doesn't mention that Ice elementals take 40 from a Flame Bolt is the same reason that half the Earth spell column that doesn't deal with healing is practically exclusively Undead specific... There is an interesting bent in the very system that would almost make it feel like a game without Undead of any kind whatsoever would be "missing" something...

Not to say that I wouldn't enjoy a game without Undead, just commenting on the fact that Undead seem so deeply woven into the very rulebook and that may be why its anomalously mentioned specifically in there... Okay that was too many big words, I'm done for now lol

Just my thoughts.
 
if you have necromancy you sort of end up with undead by default. Seems how a strong portion of the game revolves around foiling to necromancers evil plots its going to end up that the rules reflect that.
 
I think the intent of the rulebook on cure mort etc (and perhaps the wording ought be changed to relect this) is as a reminder somehting along the lines of "This spell would do 60 damage direct to body to creatures that take double from earth such as most undead"

Yea the current wording can be confusing, its unfortunate that most NPCs are very new to the game and the most likely therefore to be confused by this. I think a few extra moments when sending otu the undead to explain how their earth vulnerability works will usually take care of that assuming you have a monster wrangler that can get them all to listen :)
 
Yeah actually... The first time I played an undead I was getting hit by earth carriers, and I took it as straight damage, not double.
After that encounter, the player that was hitting me with earth came to ask me if I was taking double from his carrier (probably because I didn't go down as fast as my comrades). I told him "No, why should I?"

So yeah, it's not mentioned anywhere in the book, ever. It's not mentioned on the monster cards. Apparently it maybe perhaps written on the formal scroll that makes earth carriers. Unfortunately I must have lost my copy of that scroll when I was handed my "New Player" package of every formal scroll in the game and how they work. Oh right, that package doesn't exist!

So, I talked to monster camp, and they said "Yeah, by default all undead take double from earth". Well then, by default, every undead should have "Takes double damage from Earth" written on their card.

The only thing in the book about Earth carrier is that it hits directly to body skipping over armor.
 
Earth is under the Healing effect group, so when it says take double damage from healing you should be taking double damage from an Earth carrier.

I think its more that the text in the book that all healing does double to undead is a reminder than the text on the monster cards.
 
Yeah, it's on page 98, tucked away under the effects group. It's a little sneaky to find though and it would probably be better if it was written on the card as "double damage from Healing Effect Group" - because I would make the same exact leap of logic if I was a new player. Healing means healing damage, not earth blades.. ;)
 
On page 98, Earth Storm is also under Healing effect group. Do undead take double damage from that?

What I understood from "takes double damage from healing" was the following "Any effect that would normally heal you for X points, will deal 2 times X points of damage to you instead" So if I drank a cure light wounds potion I would take 4 damage.

I did NOT think it meant "Anything in the Healing effect group as listed on page 98 of the rule book deals double damage to you."

If it is meant to be that explanation, then "takes double damage from Healing effect group" would be ample to convey the message. The cure series would have to be revisited because of the rule book stating that they already deal double damage to undead, which would be doubled again with this effect.

If you have "takes double damage from Healing effect group" on the card, the first question that pops to mind is "What's a Healing effect group?" and then someone can explain all that is covered.

As for earth blade, the way I read it is... If you swing 5 earth, a naked goblin would say "No Effect", in fact anyone who isn't undead would say "No Effect". Then you swing at undead and you skip right through the armor and hit body. It doesn't mention anywhere that you deal double damage to undead though.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top