Several questions/revisions after reading the book.

[MathGwyson]

(Warning this is long and I'm quite verbose, if you have no patience to read please move along, this is not the post you are looking for :emo: )

So, I have a few questions - some of which have been answered on my chapter's Facebook Page before Michael A. Ventrella suggested I start posting my questions here (I'm in the newish Alberta chapter).

Please bear in mind when trying to understand my train of thought that I am a very literal-minded person, and I have pretty good memory for what I read, so if I come across as if I'm 'arguing' it's not that, it's just that sometimes when new information contradicts what I've read in the book it throws me. Supplementary information that supports what's written and clarifies is always good!

My questions aren't really individual questions, they are more question 'groups' to help me understand this.

Question 1: Alchemy
In the 'alchemy' crafting section on page 55, there are 'Cure Light Damage', 'Cure Damage', and 'Cure Serious Damage'. These are not covered in the effects chapter. I would presume that the values scale at the same rate that Cure <...> Wounds does, but without the effect on undead (because Cause Damage does not have the same notes on undead that Cause Wounds does)
I presume that Alchemy effects are not Necromancy? I just want to clear this up in case someone gets on my case for illegal Necromancy as an Alchemist! The Cause Damage say 'Damage' and the Cause Wounds say 'Necromancy' in the same place, so I presume this to be correct. If that's the case, it seems that the main reason for Necromancy being illegal is balance purposes, because it deals direct body damage, why is there no similar balance mechanic on Cause Damage? An alchemist could be devastating with several orbs of Cause Serious Damage in their bag.

Question 2: Spell Slots
I have read every post I could find in this section with a title related to spell slot legality and yet none of them cover my specific question. I'm pretty sure I understand this, but I got into a discussion over facebook chat with someone who told me I was wrong (which is possible, I've only had the book for 5 days)

He was indicating that you could purchase as many first level spells as you wanted without ever purchasing a 2nd level spell slot (his example was 10). While I would love (as an Artisan who mainly intends to use spells to bring people up from unconscious) to purchase 4 1BP spell slots before looking at 2BP level 2s, my reading on this completely differs.

Here is my understanding, and please tell me if I'm incorrect about this (and if this was not the intent, then this needs rewording, because by a literal reading this is correct.)

The first full paragraph in the last column on page 51 seems to indicate (without expressly saying) that if you have any open space at the top of your 'pyramid' you have to fill those FIRST before you can purchase any lower-level spells. Keyword in that paragraph is "...the next Spell Slot you will have to buy is 3rd level" (The person I was speaking to was indicating that that only meant you couldn't buy 2nd level but could still buy 1st. I have no idea where he gets that idea from.)

This is further supported by the example before Figure 5 on the following page "... After that, he must buy the 3rd level Spell Slot."

So by my interpretation, the only legal way to build a pyramid is as follows in order;
1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4, 2, 3, 4, 5
ONLY at this point do you have any options. At this point you can buy a 1st level or a 3rd level slot. (This interpretation supports the last sentence in the first full paragraph in the last column of page 51 that says "Your ability to vary won't occur at low levels."

If this is the correct interpretation, I can't believe that this misses a few key sentences that would have made the conversation I had much less frustrating. Two paragraphs down there is a very clear sentence referring to the 'monument' style portion. .. "Further, the pyramid must be constantly building, which means that the level above must have only one less than the amount you are buying." Why couldn't a similar sentence have been crafted about the pyramid structure? Or better yet, simply have a chart showing that your first 14 spell slots have to be taken in this order, and this order only (after those first 14 hopefully the player is experienced enough that they 'know' they have to purchase the highest available for pyramid portions).

Revision Suggestions
Again, since I'm very literal-minded, here are a few suggestions that would have helped prevent a LOT of heated conversations. The next time you go to revise this book - these will help people who think like I do get the answer right the *first time*. I'm not saying these have to go in right away, but just next time, whenever that is.

Please recognize that while some of these may be 'common sense' to some people, Albert Einstein is quoted as saying "Common Sense is a collection of prejudices acquired before age 18' - not everyone gained the same collection of prejudices as everyone else!

1) Page 151, last paragraph - add that you cannot purchase Event Points for an event that occurred prior to you joining. Without this, page #13 would have one (such as myself) believe they can purchase a 'blanket' with goblin points even if it's their very first event.
2) On page #93, please add "and place all your in-game items on the ground." right before 'head immediately and directly to your campaign's resurrection point". While this is implied in the paragraph at the very middle of the middle column, it's not expressly stated, which leads one to wonder if you actually have to place the items on the ground (which is what I'm told is correct) or if it is implied that 'someone' gives them back to you (like with your clothes - for obvious reasons)
3) 'Affect' is used in many places where it should be 'effect' - and it's a pet peeve of mine =Z (And now that I'm specifically LOOKING for them to point out I can't find them!)
Page 147 - under Areas of Effect "Anyone within that radius will take the affect." You could say "Anyone within that radius will be affected." but otherwise affect should be changed to effect.
Whoever has the text data for this should search for 'affect' and check to make sure it makes sense. There is at least 1 or 2 more that do not. I have not seen 'effect' in place of 'affect' though, which is usually the more common mistake.

Gameplay Suggestion
Add a clause for self-teaching. If there's ever a situation where a teacher absolutely cannot be found or there is a political struggle that prevents you from learning something (the Mages and Healer's guilds being at war, for example, and refusing to teach the other guild that type of magic), you should be able to teach yourself for a price.
My recombination is to pay the BP cost of the skill to get it at 'Level 0', but these BP are LOST, and lower your overall level. This way, there is a substantial cost to do so, but keeps characters of equivalent BPs on-par.


Whew! That's all I have to say for now. If you made it this far, thanks for reading!

 

[SkollWolfrun]

with spell slots: the monument is also known as 'building a 4 column'. Basically, you build the top of your spell tree as a pyramid. Once you hit 4 slots, you can 'build up'.

example:
Spell Level : Spell slots
1 : 4
2 : 4
3 : 4
4 : 3
5 : 2
6 : 1

 

[MathGwyson]

Which I already knew and was not part of my question (thanks for responding though! I understand the need to skim over 'walls of text'). Granted, I didn't know the phrase 'building a 4-column' but the lingo is not as important as the concept. (Like how 'blanket' doesn't actually appear in the rulebook - except in two places but as a reference to bedding as part of putting together camping gear and in reference to using one as a 'cover' in the healer's guild for a newly ressed 'naked' individual. Yes - my memory for text is that precise sometimes.)

Is it permissible to purchase 4 level 1 spells, and then 4 level 2, and then 4 level 3, or is it required to purchase them in order 1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,2,3,4,5?

 

[youthculture]

(Warning this is long and I'm quite verbose, if you have no patience to read please move along, this is not the post you are looking for :emo: )

So, I have a few questions - some of which have been answered on my chapter's Facebook Page before Michael A. Ventrella suggested I start posting my questions here (I'm in the newish Alberta chapter).

Question 1: Alchemy
In the 'alchemy' crafting section on page 55, there are 'Cure Light Damage', 'Cure Damage', and 'Cure Serious Damage'. These are not covered in the effects chapter. I would presume that the values scale at the same rate that Cure <...> Wounds does, but without the effect on undead (because Cause Damage does not have the same notes on undead that Cause Wounds does)
I presume that Alchemy effects are not Necromancy? I just want to clear this up in case someone gets on my case for illegal Necromancy as an Alchemist! The Cause Damage say 'Damage' and the Cause Wounds say 'Necromancy' in the same place, so I presume this to be correct. If that's the case, it seems that the main reason for Necromancy being illegal is balance purposes, because it deals direct body damage, why is there no similar balance mechanic on Cause Damage? An alchemist could be devastating with several orbs of Cause Serious Damage in their bag.

1. Values at the same rate, yep.
2. Alchemy effects are not technically necromantic unless something wacky has changed.
3. Cause serious damage isn't particular cost effective, which is why I expect most people don't use it. Alchemy is like throwing money. Better make the money worth it.


Your interpretation on the pyramid stuff is incorrect, yeah, but I'm not sure if it's due to the wording of the rulebook -- I honestly haven't looked at it in awhile, and I'm not sure where it's translating incorrectly for you so I'll have to take a look, or one of those crazy I Know The Rules By Heart people can chime in.

 

[SkollWolfrun]

Which I already knew and was not part of my question (thanks for responding though! I understand the need to skim over 'walls of text'). Granted, I didn't know the phrase 'building a 4-column' but the lingo is not as important as the concept. (Like how 'blanket' doesn't actually appear in the rulebook - except in two places but as a reference to bedding as part of putting together camping gear and in reference to using one as a 'cover' in the healer's guild for a newly ressed 'naked' individual. Yes - my memory for text is that precise sometimes.)

Is it permissible to purchase 4 level 1 spells, and then 4 level 2, and then 4 level 3, or is it required to purchase them in order 1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,2,3,4,5?

No, you need to put the 1, 2, 3 on top.

 

[MathGwyson]

@youthculture - I quoted the relevant passages that lead me to my conclusion, so if something is 'translating incorrectly' its in my post. I bolded the relevant keywords (usually 'must' or 'have to') Also 'ability to vary won't occur at low levels' was another key sentence.

As for cost-effectiveness, I neglected to realise that the gas was 5 (or 4...) copper more than the same-level celstial scroll. Still 10 body damage compared to 25 eldrich damage can be signficant, since I'm bypassing armour. Still, I don't think 15 points of armour is all that hard to eat through, so granted.

Also, I clued in from reading another post that since it's considered a 'poison', there is a lot of resistances to it (hence my question about undead - they are generally immune to poison)

@SkrollWolfrun - sorry I have no idea what you mean from your last post. It was an either-or question, not a yes-no question. Presuming you meant 'no' to the first part (which is what usually happens when people answer yes/no to an either-or) and that you have to make it a pyramid - why is it that you indicate that when youthculture says that my interpretation is wrong? It seems that even among existing players this rule is confusing.

 

[youthculture]

@youthculture - I quoted the relevant passages that lead me to my conclusion, so if something is 'translating incorrectly' its in my post. I bolded the relevant keywords (usually 'must' or 'have to') Also 'ability to vary won't occur at low levels' was another key sentence.

Nevermind then! I'll let someone else answer this question.

 

[Pantzike]

Which I already knew and was not part of my question (thanks for responding though! I understand the need to skim over 'walls of text'). Granted, I didn't know the phrase 'building a 4-column' but the lingo is not as important as the concept. (Like how 'blanket' doesn't actually appear in the rulebook - except in two places but as a reference to bedding as part of putting together camping gear and in reference to using one as a 'cover' in the healer's guild for a newly ressed 'naked' individual. Yes - my memory for text is that precise sometimes.)

Is it permissible to purchase 4 level 1 spells, and then 4 level 2, and then 4 level 3, or is it required to purchase them in order 1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,2,3,4,5?

No, you need to put the 1, 2, 3 on top.

Your string of numbers confuses me. However you seem to have it down: the first few spells you buy are "set" in order. Here is that order. (Represented as numbers of spells per level, lowest level on the left, each line representing a new version of your spell slots)

1
2
21
31
32
321
421
431
432
4321

Once the 4321 pyramid is reached, the option to continue making a wider and wider pyramid OR working on what is known as the 4 column comes into play.

A wider pyramid is built in the same manner as above:
4321
5321
5421
5431
5432
54321
etc.

The column is built as follows:
4321
4421
4431
4432
44321
44421
44431
44432
444321
etc

You can also do a bit of mix and matching so the following spell selection is legal
76544321

I hope this helps.

Craig

 

[Dan Nickname Beshers]

Spells must be purchased such that there is never a gap of more than two in the number of spells between consecutive levels. Further, you may have only one such two gap at any given time. Lastly, at any given level the number of spells must be be greater then the level above, thus: (spells at x) > (spells at x+1). Hence the term pyramid. This last rule is waived if the number of spell slots is greater than or equal to 4, at which point visually it looks like a column with a pointed top, sometimes called a pencil.

Perhaps a simpler explanation is: Any time you buy a spell slot you must follow two rules, which is done by checking the levels above and below the level you are buying. For these two rules when I say "your level", I am referring to the spell slot level you are buying, not your character level.
Rule 1: The level below your level must have more spells than your level. If that level has fewer than four slots, it must have two more spell slots. At four or more slots, it need have only one. The four slot exception is intended to allow you to build a column of spells straight up after your first ten spell slots, as opposed to the pyramid shape.
Rule 2: The level above your level must have only one fewer spells than your level, with an exception made of one level somewhere in your pyramid with a two spell difference at a time. The two slot gap exception exists to allow for purchasing as a pyramid, which would otherwise be against the rules.

By following these two rules the first ten spell slots must be purchased in this order: 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4. After that, you have two viable options, a first level spell slot to continue building as a pyramid or a second level spell slot to begin building as a column. You will never have more than two viable options at a time. There will be times where you have only one, such as:

5th - 0
4th - 2
3rd - 3
2nd - 4
1st - 5

In this case your next spell purchased must be the 5th level slot, as your single 2 gap exists at the top of the pyramid (2 spells at 4th - 0 spells at fifth = 2 spell difference). Buying a 1st, 2nd or 3rd level slot would violate the "one gap of 2" rule. Buying a 4th would violate both the one gap rule and the "no columns thinner than 4" rule.

At 100 build put into spells (as a scholar), you would be able to complete the "4 column" of 4 spell slots of each spell level, or 4 4 4 - 4 4 4 - 4 4 4 as it is often written. You could also have 10 9 8 - 7 6 5 - 3 2 1. Obviously this second method give you far more spell slots (51 vs 36) but fewer high level spells. These are the two extremes, and there are multiple middle options possible, such as 6 6 6 - 6 6 5 - 4 3 2.

Is that clearer?

 

[MathGwyson]

Thanks @Dan and @Panzike - your comments show that I was right about the way I read this, but the rules on this are not worded very well to someone with average reading comprehension (even when someone tries to explain it using only the rulebook) and could use a revision.

@panzike - had trouble figuring out your chart, I'm assuming this refers to number of slots and not their levels...
IE your '4321' is 4-1s, 3-2s, 2-3s, 1-4?

If so, at 4321 you still do not have options. You cannot purchase a level 1 slot, because you have to have only one less 2s than you will have 1s (according to the last paragraph before the example) You only have a choice at 44321, where you can purcase either a 1st or a 3rd. (By my reading).

My 'string of numbers' is the levels of spell slots you purchase;
L1
L1 L2
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L2 L3 L4 L5

Only at this point do you have options (by my reading)

A wider pyramid is built in the same manner as above:
4321
5321[

by my reading 5321 is not legal "You may buy more than four Spell Slots per level.... the level above must only have one less than the amount you are buying" Which means that you only have a choice at 44321, and then you can choose to go 54321 or 44421 (the latter locks you into going 44431, 44432, 444321 before you can get another 1st)

You can also do a bit of mix and matching so the following spell selection is legal
76544321

That looks legal by the way I understand the rules, yes.
@Dan

Spells must be purchased such that there is never a gap of more than two in the number of spells between consecutive levels.

That is a succinct way of putting it, plus also the gap can be no greater than one if you are purchasing more than 5. *that* is the kind of sentance the rulebook needs - the way it is currently worded it's easy to mis-read and when I was trying to point out my understanding, I could not 'prove' it using the rulebook.

Rule 1: The level below your level must have more spells than your level. If that level has fewer than four slots, it must have two more spell slots. At four or more slots, it need have only one. The four slot exception is intended to allow you to build a column of spells straight up after your first ten spell slots, as opposed to the pyramid shape.
Rule 2: The level above your level must have only one fewer spells than your level, with an exception made of one level somewhere in your pyramid with a two spell difference at a time. The two slot gap exception exists to allow for purchasing as a pyramid, which would otherwise be against the rules.

Rule 2 is not clear enough (it 'allows' the purchase of a pyramid, doesn't 'enforce' it - going with this I could purchase 1,1,1,1,2,2,2,2,3,3,3,3). I would word it as such;
Rule 2: If there is a level of spells with two fewer than the level below it, you must purchase a spell of that level before purshacing any lower level spells. (This enforces the 'pyramid' shape without restricting a column, yet still makes it clear that you cannot do something like get 4 level 1s and have no level 2s.)

By following these two rules the first ten spell slots must be purchased in this order: 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4. After that, you have two viable options

See, now you and panzike have said the same thing, which contradicts the last sentance in the 'four or more' spell slots paragraph "the level above may only have one less than the amount you are buying'. At 4321 (which you would have after 1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4 - this is Figure 3 on page 52) you must buy a level 2 before you can buy a level 1. Only at 44321 (level 5 at the top, like what is depicted in figure 4 on page 52) that you have a choice of a level 1 or a level 3.

 

[Dan Nickname Beshers]

You're inferring that once you hit the 4 base of spells referred to in Rule 1 that the 2 gap exception from Rule 2 stops being applicable. This is not the case.
If you have (using your notation):

L1
L1 L2
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4

then you two options, which are a level two or level one spell. Each one requires using one of the exceptions. You can purchase a second level spell because of the 4 slot exception of Rule 1 like this:

L1 L2 \ Here is your two gap.
L1 L2 /
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4

You can purchase a first level spell because of the two gap exception of Rule 2 like this:

L1 \ Here is your two gap.
L1 /
L1 L2
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4

This is no different than

L1
L1 L2
L1 L2 L3

where your only option is to by a first level, since you do not yet qualify for the 4 slot exception.

 

[MathGwyson]

If you are buying a 5th Level 1 slot, and have 3 Level 2 slots, you level 2 slots have 2 less than the one you are buying (the 5th). I hope we can agree 5-3=2 :funny:

Page 51 reads "You may by more than four Spell slots per level.... the level above must have only one less than the amount you are buying."

It's different from the 321 pyramid because you are buying more than four spell slots, and thus triggering the 'more than four spell slots' rule I just quoted.

Hence, you cannot buy a 5th level 1 slot if you only have 3 level 2s, as 2 less is more than 1 less. Since you and panzike both said that you can, however, this rule is clearly not being followed as written so should be changed in a revision.

As written, Figure 4 (44321) is the first time you can choose which level to take (which might be why the example refers to it as a 'perfect pyramid' - this is also the first time the book gives the example of two different ways of building, one going up from a 4th level 3 to a level 6, or alternatively an additional 1, 2 and 3.)

EDIT: Figure 5 and the corresponding example also support this. You have to buy the level 1 and the level 3 slot before you are allowed to buy the fifth level 2 slot (again 5-3=2). Interesting, though, that you are allowed to buy the level 2 before buying level 4, 5 and 6.

 

[phedre]

As an FYI, addendums are made by the Alliance Rules Committee (ARC) and revisions to the rulebook are generally made after a Symposium, which happens every two years along with the National Event. (There is one happening this Labor Day weekend at the Headquarters chapter in Pennsylvania.) If something requires clarification by the ARC it's only because it's being interpreted differently in different places, or is contradictorily worded in the rulebook, or there is no text in rulebook/databases that clarifies.

There are some parts of the rules system which aren't explained perfectly in the rulebook. That is often because the rules are written by people who have been playing the game for a long time, so to the writers, the rules seem intuitive. To a new player, they aren't always. That's a big part of why we have this section of the boards, dedicated to asking and receiving questions about the rules.

There may not be a new rulebook (after v. 1.1) in the next couple years, unless major changes happen to rules this summer, or someone undertakes the task of cleaning up existing text with the go-ahead from the owners and/or ARC.

Now back to the discussion on spell slot purchases :lol: (the reading of which makes me go :zonks: )

 

[Dan Nickname Beshers]

I've found your source of confusion. It's this sentence:

Further, the pyramid
must be constantly building, which means that
the level above must have only one less than
the amount you are buying.

This is meant to reinforce the two gap rule, by stating you cannot create a gap of larger than two. It's describing something like this:

L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

and saying that you could not buy a level four spell, as you would have a gap of three at that time. The "level above" in the quote is referring to 5th level, not 4th.

 

[MathGwyson]

@phedre - thanks for that. I didn't know the process - just a few things that might help clarify the rules for literal-minded people like me . Now that I've poked around the boards a bit more I realise I posted this in the wrong place, I should have posted the rules qs in 'new player rules'. My rules suggestion should go in 'rules theory' - but I'll wait until AFTER I actually play to do that. It just seems weird to have rules that allow you to purchase from both schools of magic when the guilds in your area won't teach you magic if you are not a member of their guild punishable by death - and they don't allow people to join both apparently, so... yeah, you basically cannot learn both schools of magic in Calandonia.

In real life you can learn a skill on your own with enough time and practice. Hence, why it's a good idea - even though it slows down your overall development (which keeps teachers in business if it's possible to find a teacher!)

A lot of the addenda in the post you linked are in the version I bought. (though funny thing the info on elixers 'every bite will cause their effects anew' seems to indicate that a cure light elixer could be poured into someone's oatmeal to heal them for 2 health EACH BITE. I know that's NOT the intent of the rule, but it's still makes the 'literal-reading' portion of my brain whirl.)

 

[MathGwyson]

This is meant to reinforce the two gap rule, by stating you cannot create a gap of larger than two. It's describing something like this:

L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

and saying that you could not buy a level four spell, as you would have a gap of three at that time. The "level above" in the quote is referring to 5th level, not 4th.

That's the sentence I'm referring to, but it's stating you cannot create a gap of larger than one if you are purchasing above 4 slots. (The first sentence of that paragraph, the rules in this paragraph refer to more than four Spell Slots, so your example is irrelevant since you are purchasing your 4th, not your 5th+)

Do you agree that 5-3=2? This means that 5 level 1s is 2 less than 3 level 2s.
Do you agree that two is 'more than' 1? (not a trick question)
That sentence you quoted is the one that tells me that you cannot purchase a 5th level 1 if you only have 2 level 3s, because the condition of 'the level above must only have one less than the amount you are buying' is not met.

If it is *meant* to reinforce the two gap rule, then it needs to be removed or re-written, because it currently does not.

Also, if your interpretation is correct why does Belthivis have to purchase his 3rd level spell slot before purchasing his 2nd in the example in order to make Figure 5?

 

[obcidian_bandit]

The thing is that not all of the rules are in one spot for everything. You can't do the 'heal with each bite' thing that you suggested because elixirs of the "Healing" group can't be mixed into food, but that rule isn't necessarily re-listed everywhere it talks about elixirs.

 

[MathGwyson]

The thing is that not all of the rules are in one spot for everything. You can't do the 'heal with each bite' thing that you suggested because elixirs of the "Healing" group can't be mixed into food, but that rule isn't necessarily re-listed everywhere it talks about elixirs.

I wasn't actually advocating that they should I *do* believe in 'rules as intended' not 'rules as written' but sometimes the intent isn't clear and you have to go by what's written (in this case - this clearly was NOT the intent!)

I don't recall reading that elixers of the healing group can't be mixed into food, so it might be slightly hidden and should at the very least be added to page 111 (especially since that's where it says 'each bite will cause the effect anew'.

Oh there it is, on page 109 under 'mixing elixers' That's not *so* bad, because it's still under Alchemy. When I read your post I figured it was an obscure thing under the healing effect group (pg 100) but where it actually is is okay. I actually glossed over the portion that said which types were allowed because I didn't know enough about what the types were when I first read it, which is why my brain didn't file it away because I didn't actively read

Should point out, though, that Damage elixers CAN be added to food, and each bite causes the effect anew. That's a nice way to spread some damage to a large number of enemies - poison their cauldron with a single elixer (obv they will stop eating after one bite) - though need to be mindful of the 10 minute timer. (Also need a marshal to observe, but yeah...)

 

[Dan Nickname Beshers]

This is meant to reinforce the two gap rule, by stating you cannot create a gap of larger than two. It's describing something like this:

L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

and saying that you could not buy a level four spell, as you would have a gap of three at that time. The "level above" in the quote is referring to 5th level, not 4th.

That's the sentence I'm referring to, but it's stating you cannot create a gap of larger than one if you are purchasing above 4 slots. (The first sentence of that paragraph, the rules in this paragraph refer to more than four Spell Slots, so your example is irrelevant since you are purchasing your 4th, not your 5th+)

Do you agree that 5-3=2? This means that 5 level 1s is 2 less than 3 level 2s.
Do you agree that two is 'more than' 1? (not a trick question)
That sentence you quoted is the one that tells me that you cannot purchase a 5th level 1 if you only have 2 level 3s, because the condition of 'the level above must only have one less than the amount you are buying' is not met.

If it is *meant* to reinforce the two gap rule, then it needs to be removed or re-written, because it currently does not.

Also, if your interpretation is correct why does Belthivis have to purchase his 3rd level spell slot before purchasing his 2nd in the example in order to make Figure 5?

Because it's not stating that. It's stating that the gap cannot be larger than one before you purchase your new slot. The part about 4 slots doesn't enter into it; you're holding onto that from the previous paragraph and it's messing you up. You're over-complicating it. The two paragraphs are

Once you have purchased four Spell Slots
of any particular level, you need not buy any
more Spell Slots of that level. Imagine now the
pyramid being an obelisk like the Washington
Monument.
You may buy more than four Spell Slots
per level but there must always be at least as
many Spell Slots below that level in order to
support the new amount. Further, the pyramid
must be constantly building, which means that
the level above must have only one less than
the amount you are buying.

The first paragraph is giving you the four slot exception to Rule 1 I listed above. It allows you to build more directly up than just constantly building the pyramid. The second paragraph's first sentence is trying to clarify that although you can build more directly up at four slots, you are not limited in any additional way by having those four slots. The second sentence is reinforcing the two gap rule by pointing out that since your single gap of two is the largest gap allowed, you can't create a gap of three which would happen if you bought the slot next to the two gap. From this figure:

L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

you could buy a 1st level slot, maintaining the 2 gap between 4th and 5th:

L1
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 <= 2 gap
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

or a 5th level slot, resulting in no 2 gap:

L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

but not a fourth level slot, which would cause a 3 gap:

L1 L2 L3 L4 <= This
L1 L2 L3 L4 <= isn't
L1 L2 L3 L4 <= allowed.
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

I do agree that the wording can be confusing. It's unfortunate, but the concept is actually pretty difficult to put into words even though in practice it's fairly
simple.

 

[MathGwyson]

Before you read the rest, please address the point I made about the Figure 5 example, where the level 3 slot has to be purchased before the level 2 slot, since that contradicts what you wrote. Also address the very last paragraph before the example in the rules spell slot rules, which also contradicts that.

These are important points. While I bring them up in responce to your quotes - I don't want them to get 'lost' in the rest of what I wrote;

Because it's not stating that. It's stating that the gap cannot be larger than one before you purchase your new slot.

It says "Two less than the one you are purchasing". If you have 4 L1 and 3L2, you are purchasing the 5th. All I'm saying is that if you are right this needs the be reworded, as a literal reading disagrees with what you are telling me. (And so does the figure 5 example)

The part about 4 slots doesn't enter into it; you're holding onto that from the previous paragraph and it's messing you up.

I'm not looking at the previous paragraph, I'm ONLY looking at the paragraph that contains the sentence you quoted in your previous post.

You may buy more than four Spell Slots
per level but there must always be at least as
many Spell Slots below that level in order to
support the new amount. Further, the pyramid
must be constantly building, which means that
the level above must have only one less than
the amount you are buying.

This is all one paragraph, therefore it's all the same thought (again, this is where my above average reading comprehension comes into play). This whole paragraph refers to more than four spell slots, which is why 4321 is different than the 321 issue. You can buy another level 1 at 321 but not with 4321 because of this paragraph. If this is NOT the intent, the last sentence needs to simply be removed. (And the example for figure 5 changed accordingly)

The following paragraph also (which I completely glossed over until just now);

So in order to buy a fifth 2nd level Spell Slot, you must have a fifth 1st level Spell Slot and a fourth 3rd level Spell Slot

(changing your quote sligtly to bold the 'new' slot rather than requote the before/after)

L1
L1 L2 L3
L1 L2 L3 L4
L1 L2 L3 L4 <= 2 gap
L1 L2 L3 L4 L5

Disagree here. If this is true what's to stop someone from doing this...
Starting with;
L1
L1 L2
L1 L2

to;
L1
L1
L1 L2 <=2 gap
L1 L2

Another quote from the rulebook that explicitly says this is not allowed (again the full paragraph in context is important);

Basically, you have very little choice in the manner in which spells may be purchased when you are starting out; if you have three first level slots and two 2nd level slots, the next slot you will have to buy is 3rd level. Your ability to vary won't occur at low levels.

If you can't buy a level 1 at 32, why can you buy another level one at 44431 when there's still a 2 gap that needs to be closed? If your example is right, then it needs to be explained why you can't vary at low levels but you can at higher levels in similar circumstances. (In fact the reason you have to buy the level 3 slot isn't really explained, just that you do, and I presume it's because you have to complete the pyramid at the top before you are allowed to build on the bottom. If this is not true, what you cite as 'Rule 2', which does not appear in the book, is otherwise not supported anywhere except in the paragraph regarding >4 slots and there's no written reason you can't purchase them in this order - L1,L1,L1,L1,L2,L2,L2,L2,L3.. - so you can't have this both ways =Z either you must complete the pyramid, or you don't have to. There is only one tenuous passage holding that in there, and if you throw that out, the pyramid becomes optional and only the lower level matters when under 4 slots The only restriction to the breadth-first aproach then comes into play when purchasing the fifth level and further as written.

If you are correct and the way you describe is the way all the chapters are doing it, then things need to be rewritten. It's actually not difficult to put into words, and as soon as I can understand why certain things you showing me are legit when similar situation aren't - I can easily suggest a revision that's clearer.