Houses

[obcidian_bandit]

So...
For the longest time, gypsy camp as been an 'immobile wagon', physrepped by one of the cabins. Last event, our cabin was bought out from under us, so we'll need a new one at this next event. Since we don't want that to happen again, we're just going to buy a 'plot of land' to 'park the vardo on' each event. Long story short, is there a list of what buildings have been bought IG so we can pick one before we get on site? (We'll also be on site pretty early, and don't want to accidently set up in someone else's 'purchased' house.)
How much do the houses generally cost?
~Matt

 

[Sarah]

I can tell you that in the meadow and forest the only building really available is the one inbetween the guilds. It's supposedly owned, but the IG owners haven't been in town since I hired Elendil as Diera to steal the pins holding up their house banner.

Which was a really long time ago as far as game goes.

There should be two or three buildings in the swamp available IG as well.

Yeah, I'm not staff... I just paid a LOT of attention since it's easier to get to where you're going in the dark when you can't see if you know where you want to be going.

 

[Kauss]

So...
For the longest time, gypsy camp as been an 'immobile wagon', physrepped by one of the cabins. Last event, our cabin was bought out from under us, so we'll need a new one at this next event. Since we don't want that to happen again, we're just going to buy a 'plot of land' to 'park the vardo on' each event. Long story short, is there a list of what buildings have been bought IG so we can pick one before we get on site? (We'll also be on site pretty early, and don't want to accidently set up in someone else's 'purchased' house.)
How much do the houses generally cost?
~Matt

To be honest you will need to talk to plot. House and land avalability, as well as prices and who to buy from all change from time to time, and can be effected by IG matters.

That said, a lot of the swamp is open becouse it used to be monster camp, and the prices IG I have seen range from 15 gold to 35 gold. There also used to be some IG requierments you had to meet to buy land, but I dont know it they still apply.

 

[Polare]

Let's see... buildings that I know are owned:

Earth Guild (Meadow, closest towards trails to tavern)
Brotherhood of the Star (Meadow, with ramp)
Daylynn & Kiarra's house (old Gypsy Camp, south side of Meadow towards the Forest)
Polare's House (north side of Meadow, between BotS and Earth Guild across from Daylynn & Kiarra's - yep, just bought it last event as the building we'd been in was bought)
Valvatein's House (Swamp, with ramp)
Kauss' House (Forest, west-north building)

Not sure which other buildings in the Forest are currently owned.

-Bryan

 

[Sarah]

Not sure which other buildings in the Forest are currently owned.

-Bryan

...the one back behind the tree that Shikar, Eli and their entourage stay in?

 

[Saephis]

Forest is as follows, Left to Right:

Burnt land where Zodiac once was

Eli's House

Newly owned house (Formerly Robert's)

Kauss' house

 

[Sarah]

So, it looks like open property is in the swamp. Enjoy.

 

[Egor]

Fuzzy Mugs owns the house in the swamp which opens towards the tavern so it faces North-ish. Standing on the house with a ramp's porch AKA Val's house facing away from the door it's the house on the right. As far as I know the other two buildings there are open for sale.

 

[Cerulean Jax]

I'll probably be lynched for this, but, am I the only one who thinks that OOG claiming a particular cabin for yourself EVERY single time you go there, as an IG owned property, is rather silly? No one, in my opinion, should have sole rights to a cabin or property OOG that they don't actually OWN OOG, regardless of where it's supposed to be IG.

Case in point, I and several others had to vacate a cabin that we had claimed during the October event because it was "Kauss' Cabin" even though Kauss' player wasn't even at the event...again, just MY opinion, but i think that kind of thing is not only needlessly selfish and overpossessive, but silly.

If you want a particular cabin OOG, why not just get there early and move into it?

 

[Shikar al'Basteua]

It's a layer of realism that aids in the suspension of disbelief. Having to pretend that a cabin is something more than four walls around eight beds is enough without also having to also imagine that whatever cabin you happen to get is the same one you're in every time.

Being kicked out of a cabin when the 'owners' are not at the event is inane though, I'll agree.

 

[Polare]

You bring up reasonable questions. There was a lengthy thread on this a while back when cabins were first "sold" (can't seem to find it in the search function though) and I'll try to sum up some of the arguments.

1. Like Dan said, it adds to suspension of disbelief. We're supposed to be in the same town every event we're at Millers - the Crossroads. It very much helps to know that when you want to find person X, they're here. When you want to find person Y, they're there. The characters live full-time in the Crossroads, and the game should reflect that.

2. I'd flip your comment around and ask why you think it's reasonable in-game that your character can show up at an arbitrary cabin and claim it for a weekend? In the IG world, these cabins are all owned by *someone*. In the past it's been somewhat glossed over by saying "the Adventurer's Quarter was left vacant", but personally I find it much more reasonable to expect to either have to buy or rent when I get to an event. When I've traveled to other chapters, I've had to pay rent to other characters at times. There are characters who choose to bring tents instead of staying in cabins. There are always choices available.

3.

If you want a particular cabin OOG, why not just get there early and move into it?

This is often not a reasonable expectation. Many people *cannot* get on site early, many can only get on site very late.

4. Something else that was discussed in the last thread is that any consequences of staying in a cabin should be dealt with IG. If people told you to move out of Kauss' cabin at an event, did they do so IG or OOG? People might let you know OOG, but if you want to stay there you can - you'll just have to deal with the repercussions IG. If nobody from Kauss' household shows up, there's no problem. If they do, though, and you don't leave, they are fully justified IG in getting the Ducal Guard to evict and possibly arrest you.

5. A last point that was brought up in the last thread is that Plot should keep at least 1 or 2 cabins unowned (and un-buyable by PCs) so that there is always space for those who don't want to stay in a PC-owned cabin. I think so long as this is followed, the IG system of ownership is very reasonable.

-Bryan

 

[obcidian_bandit]

Since the old Zodiac building is physrepping a "husk", I would like to purchase the building OOG, and 'the lot nearby' IG, if that's possible. So far it doesn't look like it's being used by a group, and IIRC, Kreiger et. al. were at Eli's last event, and no longer in that building. So long as no one already has claim to the building, I'd like "dibs" as it were. No use in having a standing building oog used up physrepping a burnt down patch of ground, especially when the bramble patch just behind the house could do just as good a job of physrepping said charred remains.
So long as that's OK with plot, who is the Keeper of the List, that I may add my name unto it?

 

[Seattle_Dave]

unfortunately, that burned out husk was purchased last game by some enterprising individuals.

I am of two minds on the whole house purchasing thing. While it does allow for a certain air of in game feeling, I would like to bounce the possibility of people reserving cabins with pre-reg. If you have IG purchased a cabin you can have the cabin you "have always had" - but you have to pre-reg to ensure it is held out.

FWIW - only those with noble title can actually *own* the lad, everyone else just long term leases it.

 

[Slice]

4. Something else that was discussed in the last thread is that any consequences of staying in a cabin should be dealt with IG. If people told you to move out of Kauss' cabin at an event, did they do so IG or OOG? People might let you know OOG, but if you want to stay there you can - you'll just have to deal with the repercussions IG. If nobody from Kauss' household shows up, there's no problem. If they do, though, and you don't leave, they are fully justified IG in getting the Ducal Guard to evict and possibly arrest you.-Bryan

I just want to reiterate this point, as I feel it is very important. Having the same cabin event after event is great, I love it, as it makes ig home feel far more realistic, but none of the cabins belong to the players, just the characters. So telling a pc they can not stay in a particular cabin is not cool OOG. If a person/group picks a cabin, and someone tells you that it is owned/or typically belongs to a certain group this is how I would recommend handling it.

*If you are not overly attached to that cabin and have not set up your stuff, the easiest thing to do is ask where an available cabin is, and set up your stuff in a that new cabin.

*If you have set up your stuff, it is worth explaining it to the group that regularly stays there and try to work something out. Maybe you rent a few bunks from that group, maybe you storyline a reason to be staying together ig, or worse case scenerio maybe you can convince them to help you move and reset up so at least it goes a little quicker.

*If you are stuck on staying, and they are stuck on you leaving (whether that be because there are not enough bunks for everyone, or maybe the characters just dont get along) then it is worth duking it out ingame. I have done this as Slice for house Zodiac, and it was awesome. This can be done through storylining if everyone wants to be fully set up before game, or it can be done during the event itself.

The key thing to remember is that although it is totally ok to get territorial IG it is not ok to do it OOG. Just be prepared that if you do set up in someones IG house that they may come knock on your door and kick your ***.


Well thats my two cents and added friendly reminder.

 

[Cerulean Jax]

I just want to reiterate this point, as I feel it is very important. Having the same cabin event after event is great, I love it, as it makes ig home feel far more realistic, but none of the cabins belong to the players, just the characters. So telling a pc they can not stay in a particular cabin is not cool OOG. If a person/group picks a cabin, and someone tells you that it is owned/or typically belongs to a certain group this is how I would recommend handling it.

*If you are not overly attached to that cabin and have not set up your stuff, the easiest thing to do is ask where an available cabin is, and set up your stuff in a that new cabin.

*If you have set up your stuff, it is worth explaining it to the group that regularly stays there and try to work something out. Maybe you rent a few bunks from that group, maybe you storyline a reason to be staying together ig, or worse case scenerio maybe you can convince them to help you move and reset up so at least it goes a little quicker.

*If you are stuck on staying, and they are stuck on you leaving (whether that be because there are not enough bunks for everyone, or maybe the characters just dont get along) then it is worth duking it out ingame. I have done this as Slice for house Zodiac, and it was awesome. This can be done through storylining if everyone wants to be fully set up before game, or it can be done during the event itself.

The key thing to remember is that although it is totally ok to get territorial IG it is not ok to do it OOG. Just be prepared that if you do set up in someones IG house that they may come knock on your door and kick your ***.


Well thats my two cents and added friendly reminder.

I can udnerstand both sides, to some degree, but yeah, it was an OOG order that i followed because i didn't know anything else. And Kauss was never there that weekend.

I guess what i'm seeing, at least so far, is that no one much likes the swamp area, which is understandable since it has the feeling of being mcuh farther away from the bathrooms or other areas of comfort. SO of course, that's where the people who don't own anythng IG wil get put, whether they like it or not. At any rate, I wasn't intending to start any sort of argument, I just wanted to know the reasons behind it. Like Jax, I tend to question things before blindly accepting them

 

[Polare]

I am of two minds on the whole house purchasing thing. While it does allow for a certain air of in game feeling, I would like to bounce the possibility of people reserving cabins with pre-reg. If you have IG purchased a cabin you can have the cabin you "have always had" - but you have to pre-reg to ensure it is held out.

That seems reasonable to me, although might give rise to some IG/OOG schizophrenia. If nobody 'claims' a cabin during prereg, but shows up at the event and owns the cabin, what happens? Presumably they would handle the situation IG... just like if they prereg'd and someone still showed up?

Or is the intent more like "if you prereg, we'll explicitly post a sign on the door before game starts saying 'this building owned by X' and if people still go in there they'll at least be informed they're facing IG consequences"? That might be the more useful path to take.

-Bryan

 

[Seattle_Dave]

Yes, I was thinking we would post a sign on the pre-regged cabins for those who own them. There are a couple of other bugs I am seeing already so it's something I am going to have to sit down and actually think about before posting the final details.

 

[Kauss]

I'll probably be lynched for this, but, am I the only one who thinks that OOG claiming a particular cabin for yourself EVERY single time you go there, as an IG owned property, is rather silly? No one, in my opinion, should have sole rights to a cabin or property OOG that they don't actually OWN OOG, regardless of where it's supposed to be IG.

Case in point, I and several others had to vacate a cabin that we had claimed during the October event because it was "Kauss' Cabin" even though Kauss' player wasn't even at the event...again, just MY opinion, but i think that kind of thing is not only needlessly selfish and overpossessive, but silly.

If you want a particular cabin OOG, why not just get there early and move into it?

Just as a note from me. IG Kauss signed a document loaning the IG payed for cabin to another charicter. So while I was not there, IG my title to the cabin was in effect.
In addition ooc the cabins are not all the same, and so for both IG ease (aka knowing where I am living each time) and ooc ease (Knowing the cabin has a lock and the beds are not bolted to the floor) It helps me quite a bit to own the cabin IG.

 

[Kauss]

I can only speak for myself but I want to remind people that since someone owns the cabin IG, they would be officaly in town at any time. The reason we dont pre ward/pre lock the cabins is fully ooc so IG it would be a little harder to just move into a owned cabin.

Also as I said before, the swamp is underused not due to location, but due to the fact it used to be monster camp. A lot of the owned buildings were bought back then so no one was allowed to own space in the swamp.


As to jax, sorry if you got told to move out ooc, but IG if anyone Kauss has given IG permition to stay there is staying there then there is a good reason for it to be the exact same cabin.

Now I have to say, if the camp is full, and neither I nor anyone I have allowed to be in my house are there, go for it, call it a diff house (needs of the game) but if that isnt the case, then owned houses should be played as owned houses. If that isnt the case then they shouldnt have been buyable in the 1st place.


That all said, a personal statment. I know that if I went to an event, and there were open cabins and I was told that I could not stay in "my" cabin becouse I didnt show up early enuf, not becouse of a lack of room or some ooc issue with the cabin (like wasps) then I would be rather pissed and honestly would most likly toss the weekend. Just that may be just me.

 

[Johnathan Lancaster]

See, this is one discussion that really doesn't sit well with me. Its another area of the in-game dynamics that is shaped around the meta-game.

Some of these houses are used regularly by in-game characters in their day-to-day lives - even in the downtime. It doesn't make sense that someone would swoop into your locked house one day while you were out and start using it with your stuff inexplicably nowhere to be seen. While yes, there may be a good in-game reason, such as a malicious attempt to intrude into one's abode, but it all falls down when its a simple mistake made out-of-game.

To use Kauss' house as an example: Johnathan lives there as well. How can an honest mistake be made if one enters Kauss' cabin, discards all of the defenses, move out all the belongings that the characters own, and claim that noone was living there at the time? To Johnathan, he's been using Kauss' house for quite a while now. It just seems so inconsistent to have someone "accidentally move in" to a house that has been in use quite obviously for a very long time. It would be like breaking into someone's real-life house and then claiming that you didn't know someone was living there when you get busted for it.

I also think that its uncool to hold a character responsible in-game for an out-of-game misunderstanding. Why should someone's character get in trouble IG for the misactions of an OOG player? Frankly I hate it when that happens.

I can see this happening for the more traveling characters who tend to go wayward during the downtime yet seem to favor a particular cabin: they don't use that cabin regularly duirng the downtime, so it would appear that the building was abandoned or not in use as travellers and nomads tend to not keep many belongings (much less leave them behind). However, for a place that is used in everyday life for certain characters to come into such jeopardy because of out-of-game misunderstandings? Seems very inconsistent in my eyes.